Brand New Listing! Perfect University City Home That Should Go Fast

The listing for this new-to-market University City home for sale, built around 1925, is as brief as they get at the moment: “stunning light filled fully updated home in Sadie alexander catchment. updated windows, electric, a/c, insulation and parking!” Perhaps, though, that’s all that needs to be said given the photos, which reveal the beautiful windowpane facade characteristic of many of the homes in this area, as well as exquisite detail inside.

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Let’s take a census, shall we, of what’s to love in each room:

Living room: hardwood floors, hearth, ceiling, stairway
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Dining room: Windowpane doors, molding
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Kitchen: Countertops, cabinets, floors
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Bedroom 1: steps, doors, hardwood floors
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Bedroom 2: doors to balcony, hardwood floors, unusual angles
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Bedroom 3: hardwood floors, bay window
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Bedroom 4: hardwood floors, ceiling design, ceiling fan, windows
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Bathroom 1: clawfoot tub
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Bathroom 2: subway tile walls, marble sink and accents, shower fixtures, wooden door
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In 2003, the house sold for $220,000, then sold to the current owner in 2007 for $373,000. The current asking price of $499,999 shows that homes in this neighborhood consistently appreciate, if not in skyrocketing fashion like those in G-Ho. The steady presence of eds and meds guarantee a solid investment, especially in a house with covered parking and private backyard space.

THE FINE PRINT
Beds: 5 beds
Baths: 2.5
Square feet: 2,101
Built in: 1925
Price: $499,999

Listing: 540 S 45th Street [Redfin]

  • Philly0312

    Vick sounds like he has been all over it since the middle of last week.

    • Token

      Yea throwing balls into fly swatters sounds like progress.

      With Vick its about the games. Its about how he reacts to a team coming after him or disguising a blitz. Can he pick things up better than he has for the past 10 years.
      He will always throw pretty balls in practice. But throwing a pretty ball is about 10% of what you need to be a good NFL QB. Vick isnt getting any better at this point. But some people just keep falling for the same story line every single year.

      What im getting out of all this is that the Eagles are not strong at the QB spot, I think we all know that. Luckily next years draft shapes up to be a real nice one for those looking for signal callers. If Foles or Barkley cant beat out Michael Vick in a system that calls for accuracy and brains, then they have no future here.

      Cant wait for Friday.

      • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

        *rolls eyes*

        Vick’s batted down passes SIGNIFICANTLY decreased from 2011 – 2012 – that’s called “getting better.”

        ” If Foles or Barkley cant beat out Michael Vick in a system that calls for accuracy and brains, then they have no future here.”

        Vick’s been 60% as an Eagle – Foles finished what 62% last year mainly dinking and dunking it. Brains? Are you serious? ‘Cause Vick is just SO dumb though he’s managed to be a starting QB int he league for 10 years.

        Just stop. Go root for someone else.

        • Pennguino

          The batted pass are still SIGNIFICANT even in shorts or pads. He has hit the fly swatters at least 4-5 times already. Twice today and looking at the tweets Clifton and Logan also batted passes. Those tipped, batted balls that are up for grabs that are potential INT’s. It’s funny somewhat and kind of amusing (ha ha Vick threw it into a net) until you look at the reality of it.

          The completion percentage was not mainly dink and dunk. Foles AND Vick targeted the short pass 80% of the time. They were even in it. Find another argument. This one is false.

          Both QB’s are still neck and neck. No one has significantly played above and beyond the other.

          • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

            “Both QB’s are still neck and neck. No one has significantly played above and beyond the other.”

            Keep telling yourself that.

          • #7

            We shall see

          • BrickSquadMonopoly

            Im callin BS on that stat

          • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

            IF you consider short passes 1-20 yards than yes BUT most of Foles passes were between 1-15 so no.

          • Dutch

            The bulk of Foles passes were for 4 yds at the max. He completed 3 passes beyond 20 yds. Key in his problems is he can’t hit the out pattern more than 10 yds off the line of scrimmage. Floating balls through a defense in the NFL isn’t going to work for Foles or anyone else. Barkley does have placement on a ball for receivers and great anticipation and touch. Foles still needs to develop those attributes and develop them under a rush.

          • Pennguino

            look up the data and enlighten yourself. Your self delusional thoughts are clouding what you thought you saw.
            In the 11-20 range Foles has a QBR of 94. Vick has a QBR of 85. I still think Vick has a stronger arm and can throw with more velocity. I think he is better in the mid to deep game. It is something that Foles will work on.

          • Pennguino

            I haven’t found a site that breaks it down to 15 yards. Would like to see it if you have a link. I am not discounting it. Would just like to see it.

          • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

            Um…this site broke it down to 15 yards. lol.

          • Pennguino

            thnx

          • Pennguino

            Sorry, 80% was the completion percentage of Foles. Wrong column.

            The numbers from behind the LOS out to 10 yards were

            67.6% for Foles
            67.8% for Vick

            http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/players/5448/passing_splits.html
            http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/football/nfl/players/25798/passing_splits.html

            +41 Yards
            Foles 25%
            Vick 18.2.
            As I have stated before. I think Vick throws a better deep ball. But Kelly’s system looks to be a short passing / heavy run game. There Foles has the edge by 5% on completion.

          • Dutch

            It’s better a ball is batted down at the line than tipped floating through a defense and intercepted like Foles balls going through a defense. Vick doesn’t have a problem putting zip on a ball and has one if not the strongest arm in the NFL, Foles passes were 4 yds or less with only 3 pass completions over 20 yds in 2012.

            You guys keep telling yourself this is a real competition if that makes you feel better but in reality it’s not. Eagles defensive backs and linebackers are picking Foles like immigrants pick fruit. It’s not difficult, he doesn’t have zip on his ball, has difficulties reading defenses and stares down his receivers so defenders are with ease beating receivers to Foles passes.

          • Pennguino

            AS Brick stated below. I call BS. Show me the stats you are reading. SI has Foles completing 3 less balls than Vick over 20 yards.
            If anything Vick is thought of as not being strong in the defense reading by the media and analyst.
            Staring down receivers. This is a common trait with ALL rookies.
            Immigrants picking fruit…sigh
            Way to stay classy princess

        • #7

          LOL!! Young “Token” needs to go ahead and log off now lol

        • Token

          I just want the off season to be over. I just want to get Vick on the field and let him be the player he has always been so we can finally rid ourselves of one of the worst signings in franchise history.

          I look forward to talking with you a few weeks into the season.

          • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

            LOl.

            The worst signing in franchise history went 8-8 in a year that the defense couldn’t stop ish and the super bowl champions were 9-7.

            The worst signing in Egales franchise history who has the best divisional record of any of the QBs in the East.

            The worst signing in franchise history manged to win 3 games and was in position to win 2 more (hi crap defense) with no oline and a STILL Sh*tty defense. With a coach and OC who were calling 7 step drops and running play action but never running the ball.

            But yes. I know. It was all the QBs fault.

          • Token

            How far have fans expectations fallen? What a beaten down fan base. Just listen to yourself.

          • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

            The only beaten down fan is you Mr. Grumpy Pants.

            Unlike you I know football is a TEAM sport – if the bulk of a team is bad a QB not named Brady or P. Manning is not winning anything.

          • GoBirds1

            BB, please explain Vick’s implosion at the end of the season and into the POs in ’10, after his greatest stretch of football in his NFL career. And please explain his horrid record in playoff games??? I am sick of highlight makers and stat compilers as our QB. I want a winner that Wins!!!

      • Dutch

        I told you every day and twice on Sundays Foles wasn’t ready. He looks good when there is no defense covering his receivers but enter a defense and he looks the same way he looked in his appearances last season and while at Arizona, no good enough.

        The Eagles missed their QB when they passed on Geno Smith who played in the same offense except he threw the ball more.

        • Pennguino

          Va-Geno is a drama queen and a head case. We just got over that. Don’t need another one.

        • #7

          Man I can’t lie. I don’t trust Geno man, but Vick would have beat his a$$ out too…lol

        • Token

          Geno Smith is a non factor. Just a guy. Chip obviously feels the same way.

          Maybe Chip knows he wants one of these kids coming out next year and figured he will just work with what he has for a year.

          • Dutch

            Chip doesn’t need a high pick QB to come into this offense just to hand the ball to Shady. That would be a waste of a good position in the draft. Chip Kelly is not a put the ball in the air coach and he has never been. He’s not going to divert from what made him a highly recruited coaching prospect.

          • Token

            come off it. You need a QB to win. This isnt college. Even if Chip thought that way, the organization knows better. If they really seemed content to not get a legit QB then its probably time we all stopped wasting our time with this team. You can run the ball all you want, but you need a QB to win you the games.

            While Chip certainly believes in running the ball, he passes. He his offenses pass very well. At New Hampshire they passed. At Oregon they passed. I Think his QBs there always had over 30 TDs passing. Its all about efficiency.

      • #7

        Those were his only incompletions

  • Mr. Wu

    Well it seems Vick does better with pads, Foles is more of a tampon guy

    • Token

      Why is this the new thing to say? Vick better in pads? We have all watched this guy over the last couple years right? Am I dreaming or was he in pads then? QBs dont get touched in practice regardless of if they are in pads or not.

      • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

        Are you even an Eagles fan? You’ve got to be the grumpiest “fan” I know. Pads is different than shorts b/c there is a live rush – so even though a QB can’t get tackled he’s still has defenders in his face – also the WR/TE CAN get hit – so how you place the ball matters. Also how you throw changes when you’re in pads and not. IT matters.

        Also the last couple of years you saw Vick (and Foles) with a shi**y oline and piss poor defense. But hey…it was all the QBs fault. I know.

        • Mr. Wu

          Are you even an Eagles fan? Your’ve got to be the grumpiest “fan” I know

          Thats saying a lot in Philly hah

          • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

            lol. So true.

          • #7

            Yep

      • Mr. Wu

        Lol….think you missed the joke….there was nothing serious in my comment

        • Pennguino

          It was a good joke.

          • Richard Colton

            wu is ALWAYS funny. to the MAX.

      • Dutch

        Then by your logic it should be that much easier for Foles to show himself better than Vick in practice but he isn’t. Once Barkley gets used to the speed Foles will be further demoted.

        • Token

          Well yes, if Foles cant beat Vick then hes not a NFL starting QB. Vick is in the bottom quarter of starting QBs in this league.

          Barkley? If People think Foles has no arm they havent seen anything yet. He would not only have to show his short to mid game has enough zip, but also show he excels much more mentally to make up for the lack of physical arm talent.

          If Foles doesnt step up now, then we desperately need a QB in the high first round next year.

      • #7

        You argument is getting weak. Where you at @nicksaenz1

        • #7

          Crickets

  • bushisamoron

    Preseason games will determine if Vick gets the opportunity to get injured as the starter or injured as he comes off the bench

    • #7

      You already thought it would be over already. Vick wasn’t smart enough to run this offense. Tell the truth that you didn’t think that. The system don’t matter to Vick..west coast..read-option. He should beat Nick Foles. I like Foles to be the backup, and that’s a good job in the NFL. You’re the most popular man in town

  • EuropeanEagle

    As much as I like Cole and Graham, I think we can already predict our next first round pick will be an OLB who can actually cover. If not a quarterback of course.

    • cliff henny

      i’m thinking bridgewater or marioti. then 2-4 is cb, safety, olb unless graham goes ape-shit. why i dont really get the foles vs vick debate, i think the answer is neither when all is said and done. think both will be servicable in kelly’s offense and we can go 7-9 or 8-8 (weak schedule helps) with either till kelly gets his perfect qb.

      • Dutch

        The Eagles missed the perfect QB when they allowed Geno Smith slip by, that kid ran the same offense Chip Kelly is installing the difference was West Virginia took advantage of Smith’s accuracy and arm and threw the ball instead of rushing. Neither of the kids you are lobbying for played the competition or looked as sharp and comfortable as Smith

        • GoBirds1

          If you want to hitch your wagon to Donovan Part 2, for the next 10 years, then Smith is your guy. He will get by with all his talent but will never develop into a complete NFL QB that can take you to the promise land.

      • Richard Colton

        ohh wow. way too early to start predicting next years 4th round pick. Who knows? if 30 year olds Peters & Toddfather start acting their age, we may be looking LT in round one again. I wouldn’t rule out any premium postion in next year’s draft. 10 months is an NFL lifetime.

        • cliff henny

          aint that the truth…one week in training camp is a lifetime.

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    “After practice, I asked Geathers if it’s hard letting up during these sessions.

    His response: “I don’t let up. I never let up. Never will. I’m going to finish you.”

    OK then. Moving on…”

    LMAO!!!!

    The funniest quote on Twitter today about the camp fight was someone asked who Geathers was fighting – and a reporter responded “the whole offense probably. Only then would it be a fair fight.”

    lol

    • Landsurveyor

      I would like to get that on a T-shirt.

  • Richard Colton

    Boykin and Kendricks are continuing to have a great camp, which means Howie continues to have a great 2011 draft.

    The really interesting thing that came out for me was the way CK shuffles the O-line. He doesn’t care about moving the entire line around if there’s an injury, as long as the top five guys are on the field.

    • Pennguino

      I hear ya. I wonder how much of the whole shift is due to there are no other tackles? Kelly is down with a back issue and Wang was hurt too.

      • Richard Colton

        right, but what surprised me most was LT/RT. If Peters gets hurt – Lane goes to LT and Herremans to RT. 3 O-line moves for one injury. Plug and play.

        • JofreyRice

          I’ll have to see that work to judge whether or not it’s a smart move. I’m kind of partial to the conventional wisdom that you’re weakening three positions with a move like that.

          It’s really going to be interesting to see what kind of success Chip has in challenging conventional wisdom the way he does.

          • Token

            Lets say the injury to Peters happens in like week 8. The line has looked like they have gelled at that point and all the sudden you want to switch everything around instead of just replacing Peters. I guess it speaks to the awful depth at tackle if their best move is to put Watkins on the field.

    • Mr. Wu

      From what I have read so far I have been getting tge impression Kendiricks hasnt been having a great camp. I have been really high on him for a long time. I hope he is a stud this year. Boykin def seems to be tearing it up though.

      • Richard Colton

        the beat guys were raving about him on Twitter today, for what its worth.

        • Mr. Wu

          Sweet glad to hear
          … I think I am the last man under the age of 40 that doesnt do twitter… i am like fred flinstone

        • Token

          Yea cuz he had a nice INT.

          The guy has the physical talent. Can he get it mentally this year. Anyone know if he came into camp any bigger?

      • Gary

        I’ve heard the opposite about Kendricks.

    • #7

      If those guys can do that in real games that would be a huge bonus

    • GoBirds1

      I think you mean the 2012 draft. If you want to give Howie the free pass on the ’10 and ’11 draft like Lurie did, thats on you. As the GM since then, he has to be accountable and why this roster is so thin on talent and depth. The Birds had 24 picks in those two years, and all that dart throwing yielded one, yes ONE starter. That is beyond pathetic and if building from the draft is part of your teams philosophy, then you are going to end up being 4-12 or something like that.

      BTW, that one starter does not even belong in the NFL, let alone starting. I am sure any Eagle fan knows who I am referencing, Kurt ‘I have been trucked again but I am going to talk like I am an all pro in the post game” Coleman.

      Thank God Howie finally looked in the mirror and realized, ‘I have no idea what I am doing in terms of talent evaluation and player selection, I better hire a bunch of football guys that do know what they are doing.’

      • Damien

        2012 draft was all him, no Gamble. Also too I love this double standard of, in 2010-2011 Howie made all decisions and AR had nothing to do with it. In 2012-2013 his assistants made all the decisions and he had nothing to do with it…

        • GoBirds1

          I did not imply anything that you just stated. 2010 thru 2012 was both AR and Howie. Period. You, like Lurie, pretend that Howie had nothing to do with ’10 and ’11, and it was all Howie in ’12 because it may turn out to be a good draft. My point has been all a long, the NFL is not where you learn how to pick talent on a trial and error basis and burying your team in the process . The top picks in ’10 and ’11 were and are horrible picks, some of which had Howie’s fingerprints all over them. And for Lurie to come out say how great Howie is at evaluating talent for the draft, not to mention the disaster signings in free agency.

      • Richard Colton

        I did. good catch – thanks GB

  • #7

    That’s all I’m hearing on here…and some crying lol. Vick hasn’t won yet, but it sure looks like he’s liking that system.

    Brains and Accuracy, get the ball out quick, etc etc. Vick is doing that better than the Great Foles. Accept that and support the Eagles. If Foles wins, GO FOLES, but he’s got to win the job, like Vick, and I think Vick snatches this job with two hands.

  • EaglefaninAZ

    Really not liking Kelly using Jackson on special teams anymore. Seems downright foolish now that Maclin is gone. Am I the only one here thinking that way?

  • #7

    OLD #7 out there rippin it up

  • Damien

    There again:

    QB: Vick looked far superior again. Foles and Barkley had up and down days.
    RB: All look good, who can tell?
    FB/TE: Iguana man or whatever his name is has to be first cut.
    WR: Desean looks great, Damaris struggled at first but caught on eventually, Shepard was quiet, Avant should start, Momah had a solid day
    TE: Casey’s blocking is good, Celek is cut worthy with all his drops, Carrier looked good again
    OL: Didn’t see much, however Tobin looked good again, Bam Bam needs time, Menkin and Watkins had strong days, Kelce looked as always very good
    DL: Geathers looked great, Thorton looked good, Cox killed it, Sopoaga was quiet, Logan seemingly got hurt but played well before it, King had a great day
    LB: Ryans and Kendrichs look great, Casey and Cheney worry me a lot as backups, Cole can’t cover but can rush great, Barwin looks good, and Graham showed off today, Hunt looked bad
    CB: Hughes stole the show, Boykin looked great again, Williams is struggling, Lindley should be cut, Poyer looked alright
    S: Wolff was great today, Anderson might start he’s playing that good, Allen played well overall, Phillips is an issue in coverage, Coleman is eh.

    Overall, best day of practice so far imo.

    • Token

      Shame about Hunt. Thought he could have been a damn good end in the 4-3. I think he will be a decent player wherever he ends up.

  • southy

    Passion Pit huh? Interesting choice there Chipper.

  • #7

    Cream rises to the top

    • Johnny Domino

      Be sure to check your expiration dates.

      • #7

        No need to

        • Johnny Domino

          Regardless if Vick is the man of the moment, pretty sure Chip is looking for the man of the next ten years, who is likely not on the roster, and is probably not Vick in any case.

          • #7

            I really don’t care about that. Why can’t we focus on 2013? I take that you do not want to win

          • Johnny Domino

            Ridiculous.

            You need to do both.

          • aub32

            There’s no guarantee any player will ever develope. The best thing to do is assemble the best 53 players possible and start the best ones. Why is that such a hard concept? Why should a guy start because he might one day “with playing time” become better than the starter. I thought playing time was something that was earned by being the best on your team at that position. Now if we are 1-8 to start the season, then by all means see what some ohers can do, but that’s because the starters have already proven they aren’t up to the task. Who chooses to start their season with their number 2 player at any position?

          • #7

            ????

          • Johnny Domino

            I don’t dislike Vick (really!) but I don’t think he is running this team at 40, let alone after his contract is up. Maybe it’s the management in me, but if there is no clear #1 at the end of camp I need to know if you have a more than temporary fix. Besides, Vick had his greatest success here in relief of Kolb, give him a chip on his shoulder.

          • #7

            I beg to differ. It’s your right though

          • Johnny Domino

            See, that wasn’t so hard.

          • #7

            ………

          • aub32

            I’m pretty sure Kelly has made it clear he’s looking for the guys that can win games now. We can find out who can win games down the road as time comes.

          • Andy124

            I don’t practice the “In Chip we trust” religion, but I think some of what he says is bound to be true.

            My hunch is that if he thinks he’ll score 1 more point over the course of an entire season with QB A than QB B with no extra turnovers, he’s going with QB A regardless of age, potential or anything else.

            That’s not how I would do it, that’s just my impression of Chip.

          • aub32

            Well he is one of the highest paid coaches in the league. So I’m guessing he knows something about football.

          • Andy124

            Nah. He doesn’t even know that the refs won’t let him run a hurry-up offense. /s

  • Johnny Domino

    Q: Can a brother get a taco tomorrow? Maybe avocado with a whole grain shell?

  • #7

    “Vick gets the first-team reps during 7-on-7s and connects with Jackson time after time after time.”

    Vick to Jackson will be back this year with a vengeance

    • cliff henny

      even if foles wins job, sounds like he’s in for big year. heard just as many bombs being caught by him from foles as vick. forget where i read it, but reporter was asked who’s having best camp and he answered it boykins and stated had to take jax out of it, he’s just heads and shoulders above everyone.

      • aub32

        I think Jackson is in for a huge year. I can wait to see him making plays and lining up all over the field.

        • cliff henny

          yup. talked to a friend who went to pratice, said it’s not even fair to compare qb comp when one is throwing to jax or evaluate secondary. jax looks locked in, man against boys…hope we see him dancing from the 10 yardline in about a dozen times this year! i hate that when any other player does it…but love when jax does it!

          • aub32

            I know right. I loved his Nestea plunge into the endzone against the cowboys. He should’ve gotten a sponsorship deal from that. My only concern is how well he can hold up touching the ball moe than 5-7 times a game, and what kind of motions/shifts kelly can throw in to keep him from getting pressed.

          • nicksaenz1

            As long as he holds the ball long enough to cross the goal line!

      • #7

        I don’t think Foles can get it to #10 consistently in a game. Whole different deal

        • cliff henny

          by all reports, foles has not had near the issue getting the ball downfield like he did last year. as worries go for qbs, bombs to jax is about 25th on my list. suck the secondary up but gut pounding runs by shady and brown, along with short passes, and jax will be running wild 30 yards downfield. watch oregon games, about once a quarter they’d go deep and the rec’r would be open by 15 yrds(or eagles game last yr and picture opposing TEs running seam routes)

      • nicksaenz1

        Good, I picked up D-Jax in fantasy in the 6th round of a 2-keeper league that’s PPR. I’m expecting some bubble screens and the occasional deep ball.

  • barneygoogle

    Yea, but let’s see if Geathers shows up during games. Otherwise he might as well be fighting Jerry Sandusky in the shower room.

  • Richard Colton

    Best thing about Momah being in camp is no more fans begging for the Eagles to sign Plaxico so we have a “tall receiver in the red zone.”

    • #7

      lol good one

  • EaglePete

    Im kind of amazed people think the Vick/Kelly duo will work magic this season. Cmon really. I get the rooting for Vick and seeing hes the better player over Foles thing but what I refuse to buy is some kind of special season lying ahead for this team. Sorry, I dont think thats happening, even maxed out positive thinking gets me 9-7 and a playoff loss. Thats wishful thinking at best as well. This is why so many fans want a different QB because whats the point. I know that sounds like typical negative Philly fan, but its not, its realistic expectations coming from a 4-12 team to just show some improvement to 6-8 win territory, hopefully over 5. What happens if Vick goes 8-8, stays healthy for the season what did you accomplish? Getting rest of team up to speed, still need to develop a QB or find one. Or is then the thinking that Vick leads this team to a superbowl year 2 under Kelly. Again, cmon really. I dont want to wait longer as a fan for this rebuilding to start and actually rebuild instead of rehash.

    • #7

      Why not? They haven’t even played a game yet man. This is the NFL and every year is different. I don’t get how you’re able to predict what will happen before a game is played. Please teach me that skill

      • EaglePete

        why not what? Vick has played lots of games, this will be the 4th coach that thinks they can make it work. Whats making it work, playoffs, mediocrity? We all want a superbowl no? I agree every yr is different, I agree bad teams can get good. I think this team has the players on offense to show some spark, defense is highly doubtful it will be championship caliber. What I am saying is, why prolong the rebuild, thats my issue with even bringing Vick back onto this team. I was plenty hopeful prior to last season, actually wanting Vick to do well and rooting for this team. Hard to not be discouraged kidding myself that it will be different this time, I just refuse to do that again. Good luck with that optimism. Mine lies in the player development, draft picks and coaching scheme, not just the QB position. Id prefer to do that with a young QB is all since, I dunno, its the most important position in the game.

        • aub32

          So let me ask you this. What QB would have taken last year’s team to the superbowl? Do you think there is a QB outside of Brady and Rodgers that can take this team to the superbowl> I find it funny how fans keep blaming the SB drought on Vick. I must have forgotten about all the Lombardi trophies we were collecting before he became the starting QB.

          • EaglePete

            I wanted Vick to start last season because I thought he gave the team the best chance to win. I thought we had some semblance of a team left to have a shot in the playoffs. We were all way off on that of course. What are you talking about, fans blaming Vick for SB drought. Nobody is doing that, its more like, lets go in a new direction since we dont think he can or will get that done. Its not like he hasnt had a chance yet on this team. Most other teams would have moved on already, hes getting way more than a 2nd chance here hence all the irritation and negativity around him from this fan base.

          • aub32

            What’s the point of a new direction just for the sake of going a new direction? I don’t get why someone would argue putting a worse QB on the field just because he’s new. That doesn’t make sense. Now if Foles wins the job, then fine. But I don’t get the argument of putting a worse product out on the field just to see what happens. Everyone thought the 49ers would be terrible with Alex Smith 2 years ago. What Happened? And don’t give me that defense crap because they had the same team the year before minus Aldon Smith. I’m sure if I told you Flacco would go through both Brady and Manning you would think that’s insane too. I don’t expect Vick to be a top 5 QB. I think he will be better than Foles and can win games. As Eagles fans shouldn’t that be what we want? To win games? How can we expect to have the best chance at winning games when we intentionally put lesser players on the field. Now if you’re ok with losing and sacrificing the entire season go root for the Jags. Don’t expect us that actually want to enjoy the season by watching our team compete to the best of its ability to want anything less.

          • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

            You’re making the assumption that Vick puts is in a much better situation to win games than Foles. Nothing that we’ve seen in camp or in their play last year has shown that. Both have had good days and bad days, with the slight edge to Vick. That doesn’t mean Vick will go 10-6 and Foles will go 0-16. A 6-10 season with a younger QB is much more valuable than an 8-8 season with a QB who’s gone next year anyways.

    • #7

      I get that you’re being “realistic”, but to already come into the season defeated..that’s discouraging. It’s your right though

  • Chip Henderson

    That’s part of the problem with this team, the leaders of this team are Vick, Jackson, and McCoy. They’re talented, but all they cause is drama and its irritating. Throw the while Cooper issue on top of it and it makes me want to cheer for another team. Every year this team is surrounded by drama

    • aub32

      Good riddance.

  • Johnny Domino

    Have seen the Johnson/Kelly comparison before, I think I would sign up for that.

  • JofreyRice

    I still remember PK saying he’d draft Tebow in the first round, even without knowing what position he’d play him at, and the line “Cleveland, you have your matinee idol” when the Browns drafted Brady Quinn. I listen to his rumors, because he’s definitely connected, but his analysis is like a 3 day old Italian hoagie in the refrigerator–wilted lettuce, oil all soaked into the bread, turning it into paste; there are much better writers that don’t have half the cred.

  • ready for football!

    Referring to our Phillies….in case y’all can’t figure that out…

  • ftotheyu

    Yes, it is refreshing to see that Chip is able to adjust and seek to improve. He’s definitely cut from a different cloth than the typical, dogmatic, old-school football coach. In business, if you fail to innovate, adjust to new technologies/realities, and continuously improve your product or service, you’ll be left behind by your competitors. I don’t see how football is any different.

  • Joethomas215

    Yea it just says in attendance, but still, I don’t like it, spies and stuff, they’re Falcon sympathizers,lol

  • ftotheyu

    If anything, the Falcons should be pissed (not us), as THEIR hometown team is helping an opponent (Eagles). What do we have to lose?

  • Brent E. Sulecki

    he may be. but what I see in practice hes had good and bad days just like nick and mike. I mean hes tryin to make chicken salad outta chicken shit. and hes better after a mistake. and for a young qb that’s good.

  • Brent E. Sulecki

    Polk looks like the real deal. hope he keeps it up. hes an extremely versatile back. played wr in highschool. he can catch the ball very well

  • Brent E. Sulecki

    I think hes just trying to get him ready so if he has to play with the 1s sometime hes nfl ready. vick and nick obviously have that nfl exp. and maybe to your point he may not be ready, its hard for me to say. they def have more invested money wise in foles and vick. but matt is the only qb of the 3 that he chose. I think matts time will come. he just needs to get better each and every day and show that same drive in hs and college. its a different game and his approach needs to be different but his hard work will pay off. looks like Wednesday chip will announce qb play time..after practice, hope each guy gets some time

  • aub32

    How much of an edge do you expect him to have in an entirely new system? You make it sound like Vick has been in this system for 9 years. I’m pretty sure they both started practicing under Kelly at the same time and have had an equal amount of reps. However, maybe this will make you feel better, in shorts, Vick had no edge. In practice with pads on, Vick now has a slight edge. Who knows what will happen during an actual game, where I personally think you will see that gap only widen. It’s still early. By the end of this I think it will be clear who the starter should be one way or the other.

  • #7

    ??????

    They’ve been in training camp a couple of weeks learning a new offense and scheme. I’m sure that you’re one of the people who say that Foles is “smarter” than Vick, etc etc etc.

    Then why is Foles losing?

  • #7

    Foles doesn’t have a “dominate” switch man. Geez

  • aub32

    I think it was more, “I’m playing the 3rd and 4th stringers” switch. Foles never went against a starting defense once in preseason last year. Most people forget that. So if you’re happy he looked good against scrubs, then I guess that’s ok.

  • #7

    Please tell me. Where is this switch that you speak of? I haven’t seen it

  • aub32

    The comment was made to the intended person. I don’t expect you to see things clearly, since you, like other fans, are clearly not being realistic. Therefore, I was trying to help offer an objective opinion. You should be thanking me. Now you can keep on living in disillusion, at least until the season arrives and your boy Matt is riding the pine as the 3rd string QB.

  • Brent E. Sulecki

    right im not realistic. so when I wanted the eagles to draft Russell Wilson last year because I thought he was the best qb after luck and griffin were taken. was I being realistic to think that also. A third round pick would find success…it wasn’t a shock to me. I knew what he could do if given the opportunity. and I feel the same way about Barkley. we will find out who is realistic. you are a clown

  • aub32

    Wilson didn’t have the same questions Barkley had? The only and I mean only knock on Wilson is that he was short. He had all the phsyical tools. I’m not accusing you of being unrealistic because Barkley was drafted in the 4th. Hell, I would go with a QB off the street is his butt could play. I am saying you’re unrealistic having read the reports and thinking it’s the cast around Barkley holding him back. Wilson was behind both Flynn and Jackson last year. He outperformed them in practice, while taking reps with lesser talent, and earned himslf time with the starters. Every thing I have read suggests Barkley isn’t even close.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    Haha, I love that we can’t hold Vick to a higher standard because of his 9 years experience, but Vick supporters love to say we’ve seen the best of Foles after 7 games. How does that make sense?

  • knighn

    All I can think is that you must love Foles’ legs… you keep on talking about how good he looks in shorts. ;-)

    Joking aside: Vick has been in the NFL a long time. He has worked in many different Pro systems. I honestly believe that Vick is on the downside of his career. I also believe Foles, due to his relative inexperience in the NFL should be on the upside of his career. If that edge is just a slight edge now, how long before it completely disappears and Foles becomes the best option?

  • Brent E. Sulecki

    okay. well they haven’t played one game yet. and I think it means a lot when vick and foles get to throw to desean and Jason all the time. and matt gets nick miller and will murphy. no doubt he needs to shine with them to even consider a shot at the 2nd team or 1st but I think hes doing well. will it be enough im not sure. but I know he has the intangibles to do it. if it happens great. if not I will still root for foles and even vick even though it pains me

  • deg0ey

    Fair enough, maybe my wording was a little strong. Fact is, Foles looked much better in the preseason games last year than he did in camp.

    He also didn’t face a starting defense in camp – he was playing against the Eagles 3rd and 4th stringers (who must’ve been a special level of bad to be worse than the starters).

    Fact is he made a legit step up when he got in a game situation, playing against competition of a similar/higher level when compared to the guys he’d been facing in camp Most reporters that have been at camp this summer are saying that Vick is ahead right now but that it’s pretty close. If Foles takes a similar step up when he gets in a game to what he did last year, then I’d expect him to win the job.

  • aub32

    I disagree with any fan who says we have seen the best of Foles. I do not think that to be true, and I hope it isn’t true. However, I have been consistent in my stance that I want the best available player at QB. I think that’s Vick for a number of reasons that I have mentioned all spring and summer.

  • #7

    Sigh..

  • knighn

    I will never say that Foles is “smarter” than Vick. I think statements like that smack of racism. That’s BS and I want no part of that!

  • Eagles4Life

    I hear you. Vick can’t read a defense, won’t learn the playbook, etc. That commentary was rampant during OTAs.

  • aub32

    What’s this big enamorment with intangibles? If he can’t get the ball down the field, what’s the point? Tebow has fanstastic intagibles. He was a 2 time champ in college and unlike Barkley, actually won the Heisman. He can’t throw. Now I’m not saying Barkley is Tebow, but right now he clearly needs to develope from a physical standpoint. Why waste reps so he can one hop the ball to Jackson? He should be glad he doesn’t have to play with Jackson right now. How embarasing would it be to watch Jackson lay down on the field waiting for Barkley’s ball to roll to him?

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    Great contribution, as usual.

  • Brent E. Sulecki

    he has an arm. and he probably has the best accuracy on the team. people see anyone next to vick and say he doesn’t have an arm..vick is one of a kind with that arm. many qbs have won in this league without the biggest arm. he gets the ball where it needs to be and if he doesn’t turn the ball over, that’s all that matters.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    You’ve got a few things messed up here. Matt Barkley’s ability to throw the deep ball has never been that big of an issue as the media would like to make it seem. To throw the deep ball you can make up for lack of “arm strength” by using your lower body to launch the ball, and this is something Barkley has figured out. He can throw the deep ball. The problem lies in the intermediate stuff. These are what you call your “NFL throws”. Your 10-20 yard stuff, fitting things into tight windows,into coverage, throwing across the field etc. This where Barkley lacks. Chips offense is based around this stuff, not the deep ball to Jackson like some people think. This isn’t a home run offense. This is get yards here and there, chipping away at the clock and beating down the defense. It’s not send Jackson on skinny posts and flys.

    And another thing… the big enamorment (is that a word?) with intangibles is because this is Chip Kelly’s offense. Intangibles are more important to Chip than physical gifts. I disagree with your point when it comes to Tebow. While Tebow is a high character guy, he lacks the football IQ Barkley has. Tebow was simply an H-back playing QB. Chip will take a guy who will make the correct pre-snap reads, and keep the ball safe. Arm and leg strength are not the priority. The QB is strictly a distributor.

  • Eagles4Life

    LMAOOOOOOOOOO

  • aub32

    I can see your point, but I don’t think Foles had as great a preseason as others do. Some of his biggest successes came on poorly thrown deep ball that would have been picked had CBs simply turned around. However, the lesser competition was just worried about sticking with the WR, rather than watching the ball. I think he still suffers from the same thing he did last year when it comes to down the field accuracy, and that will be apparent. I think some fans only look at the result when it comes to Foles. Yet when they watch VIck, it’s about how he did it. The same standad needs to be applied as they are both competing for the same job. Don’t praise Foles for an underthrown deep ball that happened to get caught, then in the same breath fault Vick for throwing across his body. It will be nice to compare the two under similar conditions and in the same scheme. Last year there were clear differences in both the scheme and players. Arguments could be made for either side. I think this preseason will really show who should be under center week 1 against the Redskins.

  • aub32

    I haven’t seen any report that supports your claim of him being the most accurate QB on this team. On the other hand, I have seen reports that his arm looks weak even when compared to a standard NFL QB. I have seen reports that says he has struggled with his accuracy. I don’t care what the perceived notion is about this guy. The fact is he isn’t performing to the level of someone worthy of being given first team reps. That isn’t an indictment. It’s fact. He hasn’t been getting the ball where it needs to be, and that’s why he isn’t getting any reps alongside the guys who are doing it better and on a more consistent basis.

  • #7

    Well that happens all the time on here. You must be new to these threads

  • Andy124

    No, no it doesn’t.

  • aub32

    It is a word. It means the state of being enamored. I made sure to look it up after typing it. It’s hard to be taken seriously when you make up words.

    I agree with your point about Barkley’s arm. You described quite accurately with what I was implying when I said he did not have an arm. 9 routes can still be achieved through timing and anticipation. However, I am not sure if Barkley can do the out routes, which Jackson was very good at last season. Also, as you mentioned the windows will be much tighter in the NFL and DBs close a lot quicker, see Mannings rookie season.

    I also agree that Barkley’s intangibles are different from Tebows, but that doesn’t mean he’s starter ready, nor will he ever be. (I hope he will be eventually) However, we just saw two QBs, whom I wouldn’t say are Peyton Manning distributor-esque (Not a real word) They do have the ability to step up in big moments, in big games, and have big arms. I think Vick can play to the level of a Flacco for this and maybe the next 1-3 years. He doesnt have to be able to do it every single week. Flacco doesn’t do it every single week, but he plays well enough to keep the team in games and can flash brillance on occasion. There’s no one that can argue that can’t win a superbowl. (Thanks Flacco)

  • knighn

    Saying Kathy Bates looks like Megan Fox is a bit of a stretch. Saying Casey Mattews can beat out Demeco Ryans is just ludicrous. The only way Matthews ever beats out Ryans is if the contest is “hair length”.

    What you are saying is the most fair way to go about it: if Foles is the best option, he should be played. Unfortunately, the NFL involves a little bit of forecasting and a lot of money. Kevin Kolb was NOT the best option for the Eagles when he took over (albeit briefly). That was still Donovan McNabb. However, the Eagles projected (correctly) that McNabb was at the end of his career and traded him. What the Eagles projected incorrectly is that Kolb could ever be an acceptable NFL starter. McNabb’s salary definitely played into that decision. At some point the Eagles will make a projection. Salary will be part of that decision.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    Football evaluation isn’t that near sighted. Teams look at the big picture and decide when a player has plateaued and/or is in decline and may decide to go with a younger and cheaper option if the drop off isn’t that significant, and unless Vick has gotten significantly better then it will not be. This is trend you will notice has begun league wide at all positions because of the flat salary cap.

  • #7

    Ahh…Kevin “Sprain Knees on Wet Mats” Kolb

    I still can not believe Philly fans wanted him as the starter. LOL. WOW

  • aub32

    Agreed. Though in Kolb’s case those projections were made after he had played years with the team and put up some decent to good performances. However, as you as it was found out that there was a better option on the roster, he was promptly replaced and shipped off despite whatever monetary situations were in place. Foles had his chance to do that last year. He did not. He is being given another chance as we speak. We will see what he does this time.

  • cliff henny

    i dont know, kathy bates has you tied in bed with blocks around, ready to quarter you like horse in ‘misery’…she’d looked pretty sexy then

  • Dutch

    This is ridiculous. Foles right now is not as good as Kolb was at the same point in development. Kolb could at the very least make all the throws a NFL QB is expected to make. Foles can not, and I repeat can not make common throws. He’s useless in a vertical game, and has no zip to connect with receivers in the out pattern over 4 yds. Foles is exclusively a QB at his point that can only be relied upon to thrown screens and hand off to running backs. He’s proving in camp he’s shown no improvement on connecting with those routes, and he’s no better reading the defense and making proper decision on ball distribution than he demonstrated in 2012.

    Foles has had good days, when receivers were not covered by defenders Foles looked sharp and a master of the offense. However, that is virtually playing catch and not a stimulation of NFL games. However it’s still early in camp and yet how ever slim his chances are he still, as well as Barkley have a chance to start.

  • aub32

    Sorry, but I don’t live in PA. So I have to make due with people who actually get paid to cover the team and have been doing it for years. Why don’t you start a Barkley fan blog so you can regale us all of how unimpressive he looks in practice? If it makes you feel any better, I will be watching the preseason and attending practice on the 17th. Maybe then your boy Barkley will be lights out. I doubt it.

  • knighn

    Yes, the badass that hunts wild boars with just a knife. I guess it’s a good thing he wasn’t hunting wet rubber mats!

    To be fair: McNabb had over a decade to prove he could get it done. I think most fans wanted Reid & McNabb gone. The duo proved to come up short again and again. If those fans couldn’t get both of them gone, they were willing to watch one of them go. At that point they would have taken almost anyone.

  • Brent E. Sulecki

    great idea. thanks. yeah maybe

  • aub32

    You’re right. It has nothing to do with racism, but I don’t think it’s right either. None among us are fit to judge who is smarter than who simply from watching the two play football. Neither of them made the best dcisions last season, and I am sure they will both make both right and wrong decisions this year.

  • Mr. Wu

    If you don’t think it has anything to do with rascism go read the messgae bords over at PFT anytime a vick article pops up

  • knighn

    OK… cliff henny is into some really messed up S. Good to know!

  • Richard Colton

    ohh man

  • cliff henny

    lol…cringe every time that scene comes on. i’ll sit thru the movie just for that part. james caan line ‘whatever you’re thinking of doing, please dont…than craaaaaaaack!

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    Naw it has to do with racism. RARELY do you hear the ‘smart” label tied to white QBs. even bad ones. It’s one of the reason black men were not allowed ot be QBs for years. They weren’t smart enough. All racism isn’t blatant. This is just a subtle version of that.

  • knighn

    So… thinking Kathy Bates was kind of sexy… would you have tried to seduce her to get out of that situation?

    Yeah, I cringe every time I see that scene too. Then I heard that there is some movie where Kathy Bates is in a hot tub and I think that might be scarier.

  • aub32

    I’m not saying that there is no racism associated with the black QB aspect. I mean in this specific case with Vick. Based on his play the last two years and the narrative in the media “he can’t read NFL defenses”, I can see why people would get the false impression that he’s dumb. Hell the guy never even tried learning the playbook before coming here. That is dumb. Plus let’s not even get into the dog thing. Some people will never let that go and will always view him as dumb (probably worse words but let’s keep it PC). I think given all that, Vick being called dumb by fans has more to do with Vick rather than his race. I think it’s wrong because I don’t think you last this long in the NFL, nor turn your life around in such a way by being dumb but it’s not racist in this case.

  • knighn

    I cannot often agree with you. I listened to BBD’s “Poison” a million times growing up and I know not to trust you!
    However, I completely agree on this. Like people who say, “A mobile QB will never win a Super Bowl” and forget about Steve Young (who still owns a number of QB records for rushing). When people say “A mobile QB” they often mean a “black QB”. Unfortunately Donovan McNabb bought into this BS and thought he needed to be a pocket passer.

  • aub32

    You can always close your eyes to avoid looking at her in a hot tub. Closing your eyes won’t make the pain from that mallet disappear or help you walk straight afterward.

  • cliff henny

    shoot, try anything and everything…you know you are in for a world of hurt at that point! stephen king has one demented mind…he and quinten tarratino should write a movie together. be 2 hrs like the opening scene to ‘inglorious bastards’

  • knighn

    I don’t know. I think seeing Kathy Bates in a hot tub might also do some permanent damage. Just thinking about it is painful.

  • aub32

    But you’re ankles won’t be inside out.

  • Andy124

    I agree in principle with both of your posts.

    I think we can also make it simpler and more generic. Playing QB in the NFL requires a combination of physical and mental gifts. When any QB displays a set of physical gifts that far exceeds his on-field success, the mental aspect, which gets contorted in to “intelligence” is the easy suspect. Conversly, when a QB’s on-field success exceeds his physical gifts, the “intelligence” will recieve the credit.

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    Gotcha.

    But with Vick I think it’s a healthy dose of both. Not either or.

  • knighn

    My mind might be!

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    Yikes… I’m not sure Vick has ever played at Joe Flacco’s level and I don’t expect to see him start that at 33 years old, let alone for the next few years. I think you’re setting yourself up for disappointment with those expectations. The two major differences are Flacco’s ability to stay healthy (hasn’t missed a start yet in his career) and the fact that he doesn’t turn the ball over near as often. People always say the big problem with Vick under Reid was that they tried to turn him into a pocket passer.. well Flacco is one.. so I’m not sure how you can expect Vick to be like him if he can’t be a pocket passer. The two reasons I listed above (health and turnovers) will be the reasons why Vick will not be leading the Eagles or any team to a Super Bowl. And I’m not saying Foles or Barkley will either.

  • deg0ey

    Can’t really argue with that. As someone that doesn’t have any particular preference for either guy, I’m pretty excited for preseason to see if one of them can step it up a notch.

  • #7

    Adam you just can’t give credit where it is due when it comes to Vick. Flacco has never done it every single week and he still doesn’t. Flacco has received alot of flack up there in Baltimore until his outstanding run in the playoffs. You make it seem like Vick is a scrub and no matter your opinion of him as a player, that just is not true.

  • aub32

    I cannot nor will I try to argue health. However, Flacco is a very inconsistent passer. He may not turn the ball over as often, but he’s also not throwin 40+ times a game. It’s hard not to turn the ball over when you throw that much. A reduction in the number of passing plays, good protection, and higher percentage routes should see the number of turnovers go down. I cannot guarantee the health of any player however, especially not Vick.

  • Dutch

    Flacco has been a game manager his 5 years in Baltimore he supported the ravens running game. Boldin went a long way with breaking away the ice Flacco was encased in as a QB. Flacco didn’t come into the NFL as a gunslinger Boldin is responsible for helping Flacco find his confidence in throwing the ball to him with tight coverage.

    In Philly, not since TO has there been a receiver other than Westbrook when he was in the route who could contend with a defender for a ball in the air. Flacco had Boldin who attacks a ball at it’s highest point, nobody in the Eagles receiving corps attacks balls in the air.

  • aub32

    If only he could have ignored the talking heads.

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    I know what BBD said. But as the tagline on my blog (same as my user name) says: Don’t worry…you can trust me.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    What credit is Vick due? Flacco’s numbers in almost ever category iare better. Vick is simply not as good as Flacco. It’s not debatable. Vick has nine years as starter, 2 100 million dollar deals and a whopping 2 playoff wins to show for it. I’m sorry I’m not about to start expecting a much higher level of play at 33, especially after the terrible seasons he’s had recently.

  • #7

    You make it seem that Vick has accomplished nothing in his career. Neither aub32 nor I said that Vick or Flacco is better than the other. I just believe that he can play at that level or better.

    Also, Flacco was NOT winning those playoff games with his arm until this past season. Baltimore’s offense wasn’t all that good. The defense is what made them competitive, not Flacco, until last year.

  • Dutch

    Vick doesn’t with the Eagles have the same supporting cast Flacco has beginning up front with protection.

    Rice, Boldin and the big guys up front together with a solid defense are the components responsible for Flacco’s development and success. That’s obvious and doesn’t compare to the condition of the Eagles over the last two years in support of Vick. Those points are crystal clear, the Eagles defense lost games Vick gave to them with leads late in several games over the last two years.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    What has he accomplished? 4 Pro-Bowls and a Comeback Player of the Year. Individual accomplishments in a team sport. 2 playoff wins.

    Flacco was a good quarterback and last year he became a great one. He’s 28 years old and entering his prime now. Even before last year he was better than Vick, and he’s only getting better. Vick has never and will never compare. Aub’s point was that believes Vick can be as good as Flacco. It’s never been the case and won’t happen at 33.

  • aub32

    To be fair, Vick has never had the type of talent Flacco had around him. Who knows how 2011 wold have turned out if he had Ed Reed, Ray Lewis Terrell Suggs, Haloti Ngata instead of Kurt Coleman and Casey Matthews.

  • Dutch

    Flacco gets to show this year without Boldin what he actually is in Baltimore. I say right now Smith and Jones aren’t going to produce like Boldin. Flacco and Baltimore will go only as far as Rice take them.

    Flacco is solid but he’s not going to be mentioned with the elite QBs this season without Boldin.

  • aub32

    That’s wher we disagree. 2011 Vick was much better than 2012 Foles. If he just performs to his ability, with the team working well around, I absolutely think you see a much better Vick than what was on the field last year. The same could be said of Foles, but there is nothing else to compare it to. Personally I think Foles still needs some time to mature. He had a lot of flaws that fans want to gloss over because he’s the shiny new toy. I don’t think we saw the best of wither QB last year, but I think there will be a clear divide from Vick at his best and Foles at his best.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    I’ve been listening to what if’s and excuses about Vick for too long now. I’m done with that.

  • aub32

    I am not making an excuse for Vick. I am simply saying Flacco had a better supporting cast. To deny that is a flat out lie.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    Of course he looked better. You’re comparing a rookie to a 9 year vet. Go back and watch Michael Vick’s abysmal rookie season. I have no clue what you’ve seen in Vick the past 2 seasons to make you think he’s going to get better at 33. If you compare 2012 Vick to 2012 Foles (which is a much more accurate and fair comparison) there simply wasn’t that big of a difference, and a younger QB has much more room to improve compared to someone who is 33.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    A better defense doesn’t stop Vick from turning over the ball or getting hurt.

  • aub32

    A better defense protects just one of the 5 4th quarters leads that were blown. Just one of those leads and we enter the playoffs at a point where the team was looking good, the O line was geling and who knows. Now I’m not playing what ifs. The team didn’t do enough. That includes Vick. But I am not mentioning Vick with Tom Brady and Aaron Rodgers, am I? Those are QBs that are so good they can mask nearly any deficiency a team may have. I am grouping him with Flacco, a player that is often inconsistent, has a lot of talent, and if he gets hot can take over a game. I think that is a fair comparison. You can feel free to disagree, but I find it hard to dispute the comparisons I made.

  • Dutch

    But a Baltimore Quality Offensive Line would have prevented hits, turnovers and injuries to Vick that’s goes without saying.

    Even when Vick was hurt Foles still could not hold on to the job before succoming to injuries sustained in the pocket himself. Now when healthy Foles can’t show he’s competition in comparison to Vick. Foles if listening to these board is a lot of things, except competition for Vick right now.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    You guys have an excuse for everything. Vick’s dominance over the NFC East was pretty obvious in that 42-7 beat down he took at the end of the season, after which he publicly rips his teammate in what should have been his last act in Philly. Living in the past doesn’t do anyone any good with an aging quarterback.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    You don’t seem to grasp the biggest difference between Foles and Flacco. THE AGE. You expect guys that come into the league to improve in areas of their game as they get older, usually the first 3-4 years they play well but struggle at points. At around age 26-28 you’re supposed to enter your prime. That’s what happened to Flacco last year. You don’t start showing great strides at age 33. It’s delusional to think that’s going to happen. Flacco still has time to entire the great class along with Brady and Rodgers. Vick’s window has long since passed. You simply cannot compare these two, and even if you do, Flacco will win every comparison.

  • aub32

    I find it funny how fans are ok with the lose now mantra. How’s that working in Cleveland, Jacksonville, or Oakland. There’s no guarantee that next year we will get our franchise guy. We may get someone and he is a complete bust. Then what do we do. Try and continue to suck. Go root for Buffalo with that nonsense.

  • aub32

    So losing one game with a team that we all would describe is horrid means more than being 9-1 in divsion play. Sheesh when it comes to anyone else you guys will break out all the stats, but Vick gets graded solely on one performance. That’s fair.

  • Dutch

    Foles had opportunity last season and he’s in a position right now to stamp himself as the better option through is play. To this point in camp just like last season he has failed to convince decision makers he is worth the risk.

    Chip Kelly took a look at the tapes on Foles and instantly chose to request the Front Office ask Vick to stay and also when given a chance selected Matt Barkley. Chip may not say a lot but his actions speak volumes on what he believes of Foles ability to lead a winning campaign in Phila.

    The issue with Foles is he can’t hit with a pass down field what he can’t reach. He’s still being described in reports as still under throwing open receivers down field and not being able to zip ball through a defense and tight windows.

  • aub32

    Did you watch any of Baltimore’s games outside of the playoffs? Flacco had very inconsistent year. Hell, despite having a great start, many were questioning if they were going to make the playoffs. Then Flacco had a great playoff run, but 4 good games does not a great QB make. Flacco will be forced to win on his own this year and we will see if he’s in this prime. I doubt he even makes the playoffs.
    ….
    Also, just because a player is supposed to get better does not mean they will. If every QB hit this prime age and become great, then why don’t more teams suffer through bad QBs waiting until they become good. It’s because it doesn’t happen that way any more. Besides what’s wrong with Foles sitting behind Vick until he’s ready. Ponder did it. Locker did it. Rodgers did it. These were all first round draft picks. Why does Foles deserve to be starting if he can’t prove to be the best person at his position on the team?

  • Johnny Domino

    Anybody making a quantum performance leap in their 30s is a candidate for blood test.

  • Dutch

    Foles in no way compares to Flacco. Foles can’t thrown like Flacco nor see the field and read defenses in the way Flacco does.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    Even Flacco’s inconsistent games are better than Vick’s. I’m sorry, but a playoff run that Flacco put together absolutely makes him a great QB. He put his team on his back and won the most important game in the support, and the MVP as well. if that doesn’t make you great then what does? The Ravens will make the playoffs, the NFC North simply isn’t that good. As long as Ozzie Newsome is running the show they’ll be competitive.

    Who did Ponder sit behind? Locker sat for a bit of his rookie year just like Foles did then took over his 2nd year. Rodgers sat behind a HOF QB who was actually winning games and would have continued to do so if Favre didn’t retire. He went 13-3 his last year in GB, there was no reason to put Rodgers in. Vick has done nothing to earn that type of security.

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    Flacco is not a very good QB. I will say that I think Vick is a better QB than Flacco. Flacco is in a system that recognizes his limitations AND had a WR core and defense that could bail him out consistently.

    Hell Harbaugh turned Alex Smith into a pro-bowl worthy QB. It’s all about the system when you don’t have a Brady or P. Manning. The ONLY Qbs who are going to out play a bad team. Consistently.

  • #7

    Yep. Absolutely correct

  • #7

    nice handle lol

  • Johnny Domino

    And now he is one.

    He and Mark Malone are unlistenable on radio.

  • aub32

    O how I wish the season were here. I can’t wait until you see how Flacco does without his defense bailing him out of trouble and only a decent WR core. Btw the Ravens play in the AFC, which is the worse of the two conferences and still the Ravens won’t make the playoffs.

  • aub32

    Irony

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    There are less than 20 QB’s in NFL history that have won multiple Super Bowls. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with winning 1 even if your career is 16 years long.

  • Dutch

    Vick doesn’t have to get better, he needs to play in a scheme such as the scheme Kelly is installing that is suited to his skills and with an offense that is healthy, fit and able to provide protection.

  • Maggie

    It wouldn’t hurt rabid “fans” to listen to an objective opinion once in a while, from a reasonably intelligent insider who doesn’t CARE who wins.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    ” and still the Ravens won’t make the playoffs.”

    How is that wait and see?

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    Haha Okay Dutch. Ask for an example then before I can give you one you say certain ones don’t count because they disprove your point.

  • Dutch

    Vick has been coached by 5 different Coordinators and Coaches in his 10 seasons, and now he’s coming off a 2 year prison sentence and recognized since as the 2010 come back of the year player award. Foles even with Vick being away in prison can’t begin to touch the success of a healthy mike vick with protections.

    It’s absolutely a delusion to believe other wise. In the installs of a new unfamiliar offense Vick is showing himself a distinct and better talent than Foles who can’t make the throws a QB in the NFL has to make, or reads to sufficiently run the option read.

    Where would Foles strengths show up if by chance he were to become the starter? Running Screens?

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    How is this relevant? Jim Kelly and Dan Marino played at a much higher level than Vick did throughout their careers. Marino has 4 times as many playoff wins as Vick does and Kelly has even more. These guys could get to the big dance but couldn’t win. Vick hasn’t even got there.

  • Richard Colton

    It’s 2013

  • knighn

    You keep up this idea that if Mike Vick has the proper O-line that he’ll both stay healthy and perform as a QB at a high-level. In which year(s) did Mike Vick have a good O-line?

    Secondly: Vick chose not to use protections, thus the whole Ron Mexico incident.

  • aub32

    Even if you do count those examples, which I wouldn’t in SF because Kaep was drafted high enough that he was clearly their choice for QB of the furture, the numbers are still against you. Look at the league. How many starters are there outside of the first 2 rounds? There are 4, and the only reason Wilson made it outside of the top 10 is because of his height. And only Brady started in his 2nd year. Compare that to how many QBs are drafted outside of the first two rounds. What you’re describing is not how it’s done. If that’s the case, why did so many teams reach for a QB in the 1st in the 2011 draft? Why were teams willing to mortgage their first born for RG3. Teams don’t put their stock into turning around late round picks and starting them in year 2.

  • Dutch

    No they don’t count because the Seahawks, 49ers and Redskins have not been consistent playoff teams. Alex Smith without someone managing his game would not be celebrated as a playoff QB in the NFL. I have my doubts if Andy Reid is the right coach to extract from Smith what Harbaugh was able to get out of Smith. Andy wasn’t able to get anything out of Kolb, Kafka or Foles

  • aub32

    That’s my opinion. I’m not allowed one of those? I didn’t realise everything said on a blog site is the future. Give me a sec… I’m going to win the lottery… I’m gonna win the lottery. Later suckers I’m off to see if I can become a part owner with my new lotto winnings. Then I’ll know who the QB will be.

  • EaglePete

    We shall see, maybe Wheedon in yr 2 takes a step up. Had another QB been playing last season hed now be a year behind schedule. You are assuming those teams will be bad, I thought you didnt like doing that. Ha, I kid. Any true Philly fan knows, you can only root for 1 team in each sport, your heart is never elsewhere even if you pretend so enough with that rooting for other teams nonsense. It makes perfect sense in terms of rebuilding. We just happen to think we will continue to be mediocre with Vicks best game, esp in a new system, new coach, having seen this several times already. Big difference between that and other young players growing.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    I couldn’t care less about where he went in the draft. He proved last year that he was more valuable than where he went. If you rank the last 20 QB’s taken in the first round with the first overall pick and then throw Nick Foles in there, his QB rating would be behind only 1 of them, and that’s Cam Newton.

    Foles threw an average 38 passes per game, where as Wilson only had to throw 24. His defense was #1 in points scored, and #4 in yards allowed, and his offense was number 3 in rushing. He wasn’t asked to do much of anything.

    Only 5 QB’s in the league who threw as much as Foles did had fewer INT’s per attempt. Teams playing against the Eagles defense when Foles started had a whopping 136 QBR. He got zero help from the defense. The defense was playing much better when Vick was healthy, before Juan got fired.

    And also, 3rd round is absolutely not considered late round. RG3 and Luck are once in a lifetime players. People have been overdrafted and underdrafted for a long time. 40% of first round QB’s over the past 20 years have been busts. It’s not an exact science and means nothing if the guy can prove he can play.

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    Baltimore is in for a rude awakening. Boldin bailed Flacco out A LOT on those deep passes. Jacoby Jones did too, not to the extent of Boldin but still Flacco should have been buying both of them drinks.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    You do realize that Flacco is only now entering the prime of his career, and that almost everyone else you listed there is 30 or older? You can’t compare guys in the twilight of their careers to guys that are just getting there. Same with Rodgers.

    Nothing Vick has done in his career has constituted great. 2 playoff wins in 9 years is not great. He puts on a good show, can run and throw, but he simply is not great. Vick is a career starter with medicore stats and a slightly above .500 record. 2010 might be considered great, but it took teams till about week 16 against the Vikings to figure out how to crack Michael Vick. Just send an extra guy. That’s it. Don’t even try to hide it, it’s better if you don’t. Since then he’s been nothing better than meh and it’s not about to change.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    1,140 yards, 11 TD’s and zero interceptions in his playoff run. But yeah, Flacco has never had to win a game on his arm and talent. Please stop with this non-sense.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    That was a typo. I was talking about Flacco and Vick.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    You don’t have to throw the ball 40+ times a game when you don’t turn the ball over, take sacks and fumble. It’s 2013 now if you didn’t know. 2010 is long gone and Vick is 3 years older. Vick got figured out Week 16 2010. Hasn’t played amazing since. Plus, that stat is BS anyway, He average 35 passing attempts per game last year, only 4 more than 2010 and 1 more than 2011.

    What’s your excuse for Vick’s time in Atlanta? Maybe if you stopped making excuses for Vick and just looked at his entire body of work you’d realize he’s nothing more than a middle of the pack starting QB. And that may be enough to win him a job this year, but he’s no where near Flacco and never will be.

  • Dutch

    No, Flacco has NEVER has to or been depended on to win games he is best used to manage games. Without Boldin making spectacular catches Baltimore not champs. Without Boldin or a very good similar talent you are not going to see stats in the money time like Flacco put up this year again. Key to Flacco finding another gear was Caldwell being promoted to Offensive Coordinator in the second half of the season.

    I like Flacco, and most QBs that comes out of Delaware but Flacco is no Rich Gannon.

  • Dutch

    This is bogus being 90% of NFL Quarterbacks never sniff a super bowl or playoff victory throughout their career. Once again, no matter who may be the QB without the horses up front to protect him a QB has little to no chance of seeing a Super Bowl.

    It’s just impossible today and always has been.

    This year with Vick under centers, and so long as the offensive line stays healthy and plays to it’s potential and that only means Peters being Peters, and Lane Johnson being half of what he showed in College the Eagles should wrap up the division with ease and be a very credible threat in the playoffs to ruin other teams seasons in the NFC.

    It’s because of the defense especially the defensive backs that a sustain playoff campaign may not be achievable.

  • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

    Yeah, he’s had excuses his whole career. Or maybe after 9 seasons you all will realize Vick is nothing more than a middle of the pack QB who puts on a good show and is fun to play in Madden. The sooner you realize this the sooner you can move on from him.

  • Token

    O bull. Go back and looks at the Steelers Oline when Ben was winning. It was awful. Look at the Pack in 2010. Their Oline wasnt very good and they didnt have a running game. Rodgers put them on his back in the big game throwing 40 times and won.

    ANY NFL LEVEL STARTER and even some backups can look really good when given all day to throw. But that aint the NFL. The great ones are good at getting it out and making the right decisions. Throwing with bodies falling at their legs.

    That aint Vick and never has been. And now he doesnt even have his legs like he used to. Hes is as dumb of a QB on the field as I have ever had the misfortune of watching. That is certainly not changing.

  • Token

    My lord you are delusional. You must have missed the playoffs.

    Its such a interesting dynamic with a few of you Vick worshipers. When another QB does well, Flacco had one of the better playoffs runs in history btw, its always because of everyone else. When Vick does poorly, which he has his entire career, its everyone elses fault.

    How many times do people have to see the same thing over and over again in order to believe its true?

    This town just loves awful running QBs. All glitz no wins. How many decades do you have to see the same thing fail? Wake up.

  • Dutch

    In which years did Vick play behind two Pro Bowl caliber pass protectors? No QB in the NFL that doesn’t have two Pro Bowl caliber pass protectors ever celebrated a Super Bowl appearance. Vick played with good talent in Atlanta but no pass protectors, same as in Philly. Vick played behind Peters but by himself all they were able to accomplish was one division title to this point.

    QBs only take you as far as his pass protectors pull him.

  • Dutch

    And that Formula on Pass Protectors is still a valid ingredient to sustain a playoff and super bowl appearance.

    Without 2 Pro Bowl caliber pass protectors no QB in the NFL has a chance at finding playoff success or appearing in a Super Bowl.

    A QB in 2013 as a QB in 1969 can not win in the playoffs in the NFL without protection up front. The Example for the Eagles would be the last sustained playoff run the Eagles Offensive Line included, Thomas, Runyan and Andrewes. They were responsible for pulling that Wagon to Jacksonville.

  • Token

    Just wrong. I gotta think you are just putting us on at this point.

  • knighn

    Sadly: Shawn Andrews was hurt in the first game of the 2004 season (against the Giants) and could not help pull the wagon to Jacksonville. It was a huge shame, too. At that point in his career Shawn alone may have made more than a three-point difference against the Pats.

    As for your assertion that it takes two pro-bowl caliber pass protectors to win a SB, I’ll look it up tomorrow. I expect that this wil be like many of your statements and prove to be unfounded. Though you do occasionally surprise.

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    Steelers had a top 5 (if not number 1) defense. In 2010 Pack had a top 5 defense.

    When has the Eagles defense been top 5 or top 10 since Vick has been here?

    I’ll wait.

    But yeah. It’s all about the Qb.

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    “He average 35 passing attempts per game last year, only 4 more than 2010 and 1 more than 2011.”

    1. You can’t count games he didn’t finish. Which is what you’re doing so those stats are wrong.

    2. “Vick got figured out Week 16 2010.”

    Why do people keep saying this crap. There’s been film on Vick for YEARS…no one “figured” him out…as a matter of fact he’s been figured out so well that our divisional rivals (who we play more than anyone) keeps whooping his butt when they play..oh wait.

    3. “Hasn’t played amazing since” I seems to remember a Dallas behind whooping that was pretty amazing and a few other games as well in 2011 – and a couple come backs in 2012 that were nice as well – but I guess that only works when Eli or Flacco or some other slightly better than average QB does it.

    The QB you want to lambast so was 8-8 when the Superbowl champs were 9-7…but Vick is SOOOOO horrible.

    SMH

  • Brent E. Sulecki

    think its rodmans buddy

  • Jar Jar Jarrett

    He’s….stoic?

  • Adam Banks

    Never came that close? Seriously?