For Rent: Rarely Seen-in-the-Wild 1BR on Rittenhouse Square

There are a couple of buildings on Rittenhouse Square that, for whatever reason, don’t have the cachet that others do despite the fact that they have better amenities, are more affordable and are, just like the more highly prized residences, right on the park. For those who don’t buy into the Square’s status hierarchy, both of them–the Rittenhouse Savoy and the Rittenhouse Claridge–offer terrific deals, particularly when a larger rental (rather than a studio) pops up as it has now at the Savoy.

The Savoy and the Claridge were both designed by architect Samuel I. Oshiver, who was called the “high priest of the high rise” by Greater Philadelphia Magazine in 1962 while he was building the Philadelphian. None of the three buildings are much beloved in terms of looks, but take a gander at what’s on offer at the Savoy for the lucky renter.

Amenities:
24/7 Doorman
Fitness Center (for fee)
On-Site Storage
Philly Car Shares
Rooftop Deck
Spa Amenities
Utilities Included
Washer and Dryer
Basic cable included

THE FINE PRINT
Don’ts
: No smokers, no pets, please.
Move-in reqs: 1st month’s rent, last month’s rent, and one month security deposit to be paid at time of lease signing; minimum of average credit score for all adult applicants.
Duly noted: “The Savoy is a favorite among Wharton MBA students.”
Price: $1,750/month

1806-1818 Rittenhouse [Condo Shop]

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  • z2

    515 sf is considered a larger unit? yikes.

    its quite obvious why these buildings lack the cachet despite their location. They are UGLY and the interiors are far from luxurious. And with the large number of small units and rentals, they are swarmed with young renters. The Claridge is rental but Savoy is condo and the ratio of small to large units discourages an investor from renovating a large unit into a luxurious property.

  • z2

    515 sf is considered a larger unit? yikes.

    its quite obvious why these buildings lack the cachet despite their location. They are UGLY and the interiors are far from luxurious. And with the large number of small units and rentals, they are swarmed with young renters. The Claridge is rental but Savoy is condo and the ratio of small to large units discourages an investor from renovating a large unit into a luxurious property.

  • ridusofreid

    Thanks. Good article. Lots of roster spot question marks that will be decided in preseason. If you’re a young wideout on this team , the Maclin/Cooper situations present an amazing opportunity. It is a business after all.

  • Johnny Domino

    Let Shepard, Momah, Benn get all the 1&2 reps they can and let the others hang around until more talent shakes out at the last couple of cuts. Even if one or more of them is on the PS, they will be more prepared if needed. If RC is rehabilitated, a bonus.

    • illadelphia21

      X off Benn and replace him w/ Salas. Other than that I agree.

      • Johnny Domino

        There aren’t any 1&2s in the lot, just a bunch of interchangeable 3&4s. Take your pick.

  • illadelphia21

    Djax, DJ2, Avant, Shepard, Salas, Momah. SMH at this group, but that’s all we have and those that should make it until we see some cuts from other teams. I would never write Momah off. He’s a developmental project and therefore…needs time to develop. No way to justify him getting the boot, regardless of a semi bad camp. After this yr and the next camp/preseason, if he hasn’t shown improvement then he should be in definite trouble of getting cut.

  • ICDogg

    I said it before and I’ll say it again: I think our starting X receiver will be Ertz. I do not mean a special “3 tight ends” package. I mean he will play the position of wide receiver.

    I say this because he is more talented, all things considered, than the guys whose position title is “wide receiver”, in the skills needed to play X receiver.

    And because that leaves Casey and Celek as the starting tight ends.

    • illadelphia21

      I’m not thrilled w/ our starting TEs if that’s the case. Ertz, could be used for that role but he offers no threat what so ever to go deep or even break one open after the catch, in that position. Teams would play him for the short and be able to cheat the run from his side (not saying they would do this all the time). Plus his hands have been shaky during camp and that’s the opposite of the pre draft scouting reports. He does run good routes though. So minus the size advantage, it’s kinda like putting Avant on the outside. It could be done, on a regular basis, but do we really want to?

      • ICDogg

        Ertz is not a speed receiver. But look at who else we were considering: Benn, Cooper, Momah… their primary asset is not speed. And at the X, I don’t think we need as much speed.

        We could start Damaris Johnson but that would mean we would be starting two of the three smallest receivers in the entire NFL (the third being Tavon Austin).

        Avant is a guy I like as a slot receiver. He has neither the size nor speed to excel on the outside. But he catches in traffic and moves the chains. I don’t think it’s much like Ertz. Ertz has separation ability even if he does not have top end speed.

        • illadelphia21

          All three you mentioned pose a better or at least 1/2 way credible down file threat than Ertz. None of them have separation issues except Momah.

          I already know bout the DJ2/DJax issues of size. This has been discussed ad nauseum.

          Of course Avant should stay in the slot. He has never shown problems w/ separation. Avant also does not pose a threat of any kind for down field or YAC…hence the comparison to Ertz.

          I see Ertz manning the role on certain plays, but to have him in that position, often, is just going to be F’d up for our O. We need an actual credible WR, not TE/WR. And if Chip and the team try to circumvent the issue at hand w/ Ertz then we may just be in a position to get Bridgewater when all is said and done.

    • Johnny Domino

      Clay Harbor thanks you for that, and a 3rd TE spot.

  • ridusofreid

    He holds the ball too long. He is injury prone. He turns the ball over too much. These are not opinions.

    • illadelphia21

      So who would be better?

    • Mr. Wu

      yep he does all of those things, and yet he is still head and shoulders above Foles. I mean I wish we had Rogers or Brees or someone “elite” like that but out of what we have I don’t know how any sane person would not want Vick to play.

      P.S. I am all for nostalgia but time to change the handle man…hhahaha ….maybe just take the “us” out. Unless your from Kansas City of course.

      • Jack

        Nick Foles is a second year 24 year old. How do you know what he will become? He showed flashes last year. He has shown improvement in camp with his deep ball (which was what he struggled with most last year, even though he had a higher completion percentage than Vick on 20+ yard throws). He shows poise in the pocket and has the natural ability to sense pressure. He showed the ability to get right back up after a big hit and throw a bulls-eye. He had one of the highest completion percentages out of a rookie in the history of the game. He led the depleted Eagles offense to more yards per game and more points per game than Vick with less weapons and a worse OLine. He has the prototypical QB size.

        Vick is getting old. We know exactly what he offers. Highlight reels and injuries. We don’t know what Foles is made of yet as he has limited starts and is only a second year player. I say give him a chance and you might be pleasantly surprised.

        • illadelphia21

          Wow and SMH! Your bring all the old tired arguments back into this debate again.
          No one cards if he’s 24 or iif it’s his second year!
          No one cares what he’ll become! This is the QB position. It’s about what you are. If what he’ll become was the main crux of it then why not just sit him on the bench to “learn” until he turns into what he will be.
          Vick showed flashes last year too. Who gives a F about flashes when it comes to the QB position?!
          For just as much as he’s shown improvement w/ his deep ball, he still has shown issues!
          Don’t know how many times Vick has shown the ability to get up after a big hit..countless…and many more than Foles!
          Wow more yards and more points w/ less wins!!!
          Get off it. Vick still had to deal w/ Reid and Marty’s play calling and had a depleted O-line too. Kelce played 1 1/2 games for Vick, no Peters, F’n Danny Watkins, Todd played like sh!t the whole season, Shady was off last year, and fumbling. It’s not like either QB could hang their hats on O help. But yes Foles did have it rougher. Why not include my favorite phrase…”he was thrown into the fire!!!”
          Wow a high completion percentage as a rookie throughout the history of the game. Well throughout the history of the game rules have changed making it easier for passing. And what did that percentage lead to??? Wins…nope. Not a lot of turnovers…nope. Not a lot of sacks…nope!
          We’ve seen what we have in Foles. That doesn’t mean he can’t improve. But once again if you want to develop a QB, then leave him on the bench. He’s not hands down better than Vick. All this “unknown” talk cuts both ways. just as much as we could be “pleasantly surprised” we could also be terribly dissapointed! We need a QB who can start and play now. Plus since Bick is injury prone, I’m sure Foles will get enough playing time.

          • illadelphia21

            *no one cares if he’s 24!

          • Richard Colton

            I do. I’m ten years older than the Eagles QB. It’s depressing.

          • defroe81

            speak for yourself listen if the skins or seahawks found the next vick there has to be a new brady or manning out there how would you ever know if you have him if you dont give him a shot at actually playing. anyhow hope vick winssssss lol

          • defroe81

            soooooooo many excuses for poor vick
            “Get off it. Vick still had to deal w/ Reid and Marty’s play calling and had a depleted O-line too. Kelce played 1 1/2 games for Vick, no Peters, F’n Danny Watkins, Todd played like sh!t the whole season, Shady was off last year, and fumbling. It’s not like either QB could” if young guys never got a shot the nfl would be full of old losers that get injured and never play a complete season. that being said hope vick wins out. lol

        • Maggie

          Funny, Jack, Peyton Manning is getting old, in fact, older than Vick, with a career full of highlights and stats and not a whole lot else. Yes, yes, he won ONE Superbowl, in SIXTEEN years! Yet everybody heaps praise endlessly on him. Quite frankly, I get tired of hearing how the only way to rate a QB is by SB wins, yet all the media fawn endlessly on Peyton while ignoring many QB’s who actually have something to show for SIXTEEN years. So, don’t count out #7 just yet. As the piece quoting Reeve shows, nobody wins or loses alone. Wade Philips? He was all about defense, not QB’s.

          • defroe81

            superbowl exactly why manning gets praise even though he is old and vick doesnt. superbowl exactly why they will play him over younger guys has vick won a superbowl yet…. nope but lets hope if he doesnt lose the starting job that he can take us to the promise land and leave the game like john elway another denver bronco…

        • Dutch

          What did Foles show last year that he isn’t showing now in camp which by the way simply isn’t good enough to beat out Vick?

          Really, he showed the inability to hit common routes every QB in the NFL has to hit he can’t throw the out, he is weak on throws over 20 yds, and he has a problem reading defenses and seeing the field. Other than that what has he shown, pocket awareness? That can’t be true he was sacked 20 time in 7 appearances, or almost 3 times an outing so pocket awareness is pretty exaggerated given the numbers.

          He can however, had the ball off to running backs.

          Bottom line, Foles isn’t ready and need more development which isn’t a bad thing, but he’s not a NFL Quarterback right now and not even a good backup at this point. Foles is no better than Kevin Kolb at the same point in his development nor Mike Kafka and we know neither of them are starting quality QBs in this league.

        • defroe81

          im telling you all these foles haters only after one season and not a complete season know exactly what kind of player he is that’s just bias as they are vick fans and not willing to give anyone a chance unless it their boy. they should see troy aikmans first season and the man went on to win quite a few superbowls…

      • Dutch

        Rogers is going to be in the same boat Vick’s been over the last few years with a shaky offensive line, just last nite his Starting Tackle was injured and may be out for the season. Rogers isn’t the same MVP QB without protection but none of the top elite QBs are. Brees is also going to experience difficult times because of the same dilemma. Look at Phillip Rivers in San Diego. No offensive line and his game seems to have fell to pieces the last few years.

  • SoCalEaglesFan

    I have to admit being curious to see Vick in this up-tempo offense. He’s tailor made for the read-option. Talent is never the issue with him, it’s staying healthy. I just don’t see how he can complete a season.

  • Mr. Wu

    Ask D. Ware who he would rather be the QB of the eagles? Or B. Arakpo, J. Tuck, JPP etc. ….they will pick Foles all day long with a smile.

    • #7

      Not only them, the entire NFL.

    • Wilbert M.

      Of course a D-Lineman would rather face Foles. Ask the D-backs who they would rather face.

      • Mr. Wu

        Probably a lob 50 yards in the air rather then a bullet from Vick….. but apparently Foles improved his deep ball so who knows

        • EuropeanEagle

          A bullet can hurt yeah, especially when it hits the back of your lineman’s head, or the hand of a DEnd…

  • Richaud Jeaffreson

    I think Salas has a better chance of making the team over Benn and Momah at the time. Momah is PS at best. He had what, one good practice? Benn can’t stay healthy, why waste a roster spot on someone who may be out of the line up for weeks at a time. I say they should go with these players (they aren’t winning over 7 games this year anyway): DJax, DJ2, Avant, Shepard, Salas. With Celek, Casey, Ertz, and a possible 4th, I think the passing game will be as good as it is gonna be this year. Of course of they keep Cooper on the active roster he would push out Salas.

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    It’s not hard to win football games with Vick. It’s “hard” to win football games with Vick when you try to stick a square peg into a round hole. He is not, nor will he ever be a traditional pocket QB. But you don’t need him to be. You play to his strengths – uptempo – run based – quick reads – simple. It has worked in the past. It will work again.

    Vick has a tendency to over think things when given too many options – you saw it last year: pass – run- no pass oh $#%* here they come. It was crazy. Uptempo kills that which is why he always looked good in the 2 min offense – he just played…got all the voices out of his head and played ball. That’s what Kelly’s offense does – gets the voices out the players head and let’s them just play ball. It’s tailor made for Vick – we’ll see what happens.

    • #7

      There it is

  • joe

    Doesn’t anyone think that Andy had the wrong offensive line scheme and wrong offensive scheme for Vick? I really believe with Kelly playing to Vicks strengths. And Vick being Vick, that its going to be awesome

  • nicksaenz1

    Can’t rule out the possibility that Benn and Cooper are both off the roster. That would certainly make things interesting, to say the least.

  • illadelphia21

    Not disagreeing w/ you rob, but you also got to remember that sometimes guys who ball out in TC can’t do it in games.

    Salad should make it cause we’re so depleted (I’m totally writing Benn off, had so much hope for him), but preseason games should be the determining factor of our WR corp. and even then you got to take that w/ a grain of salt.

  • Tyler Thierolf

    Usually when you see situations where speed/athleticism isn’t transferring to game-like situations its because of a confidence/comfort issue. I wouldn’t be surprised if the 2 years off have brought on a lot of rust and that combined with the complex option routes and new system/terminology/plays are leaving him feeling really unsure and lacking confidence. Kinda goes along with the reports of him looking lost and running the wrong routes earlier.

  • Mr. Wu

    he will win the job because he is the clearly the best choice

  • illadelphia21

    No it’s since he’s stepped up during that Fiasco and showed who he was the leader in the locker room…and since he’s shown that he’s better than Foles in TC, ie, w/ pads on!
    Foles had been slightly/marginally better in OTAs, ie, in shorts and even the one TC session where they moved inside cause if weather. Yet once again, in shorts that day. But when the pads are on Vick has been better to date.

    Even if Foles would have been doing slightly better, throughout, that’s still not enough to unseat Vick. He should beat him hands down (as so many Foles lovers expressed and anticipated) to win the gig. Not just be marginally better in shorts.

  • #7

    4 pro bowls and almost 2 MVPs and being one game from a SB is shining. All Time leading rusher at QB is”shining”. For anyone that can say that they are the greatest of all time at something is “shining”.

    Vick will shine again. If you don’t like it, go watch the Browns or someone else.

    Go Eagles

  • illadelphia21

    1st question was just silly and begging to be thrown back in you face. The ones that followed however were valid.

  • illadelphia21

    Your probably right. Opposing teams have shown a tendency to take liberties w/ hits on Vick and refs have let them get away w/ it. Still I would rather have an actual threat w/ the ball running the option than the guy who’s not a threat at all.

    W/ Foles running the option, all a D has to do is not over pursue and key in on Shady and its a minimal gain. Of course D’s do get tricked and over pursue, so Foles could get a couple of breaks but the “option” is nevertheless less effective w/ him under center.

  • Jack

    While the read option might be less effective with Foles, the short passing game will not be. Foles is superior to Vick when it comes to the short game. Foles has pinpoint accuracy in that area and doesn’t struggle with finding the open man. He stays in the pocket and allows the OL to do their job instead of guessing where they need to protect the QB from. I’d rather my QB have the ability to methodically move the team down the field than have a couple big runs here and there while struggling to produce on many drives.

  • knighn

    See my other post above. I would like nothing more than for Vick to prove me wrong. It would be the most awesome football thing I could watch if Vick could maintain his highest level of play and stay healthy for more than a season. The man is one of the most talented to ever play the game; I just am not sure that he will ever stay healthy and keep it all together. I am also unconvinced that he’s got much left in the tank.

  • illadelphia21

    Foles is not a “franchise” QB and neither is Barkley. There I just saved everybody 2 years. No if you want to go on to play them so we can tank the season and get Teddy and another high draft pick…then that’s a different story!

  • Dutch

    Injury prone? Foles couldn’t last 7 games. Why isn’t his injury proneness a topic of discussion or flatly being ignored by those of you advocating for Foles? At this point you would have to consider foles as fragile as kevin kolb.

  • illadelphia21

    Sigh…that comment was strictly bout the “option”.
    Yes he does have good accuracy on short throws. Let’s run an entire offense based on nothing but short throws!!! BTW…how many teams have “nickled and dimed” “dinked and dunked” and gone on to do anything in this league?! He has good poise in the pocket. That does not mean he stays in the pocket. He went out of the pocket a bunch last year. QB’s do what they need to do to try and keep the play alive. If you want a QB to just sit in the pocket no matter what then you don’t want a successful O. And he struggled a lot last season despite the short routes being set up. He held the ball an avg of 4.7 secs, locked on to one WR, many times, and had his fair share of picks, and should be picks. Plus in 2011 when Vick was QB the eagles still managed to rack up a ton of yards and move the ball methodically down field each game. That didn’t lead to points nor wins. So I can’t agree w/ that argument.

    Bottom line talk to me when Foles is ACTUALLY better than Vick and not when you guys just want him to start cause you don’t like Vick or are tired of him!

  • #7

    No team in history had dink and dunked their way to a championship

  • Dutch

    How can you not show accuracy with 4 yd max passes or screens? Foles only averages 6.4 yds per reception, and that includes Eagles receivers after the catch yards.

    I don’t think some of you are actually reading the stats before commenting on Foles accuracy, he throws late and wide. He only completed 3 passes for more than 20 yds. He can’t hit 7. 10 or 15 yard out patterns and he is useless throwing long to streaking receivers. Foles was sacked 20 times in 7 appearances, or 3 times per outing. How is that defined as having pocket presence? Foles in those 7 appearances mustered 6 touchdown passes, how is that producing? That isn’t one touch down an outing unless some of you are crediting Foles with Bryce Brown’s touchdown runs and production and Brown set an Eagles rookie rushing record.

  • #7

    Lol hell yeah. 1000% truth

  • #7

    They are going to split reps regardless of who is doing better. If they do up the reps, it will be later in TC. I’m guessing you’ve been reading that biased crap they have over there at philly.com, but Foles is NOT winning. He’s looked good in shorts, but who cares?

  • Richard Colton

    don’t send me to that website for anything. please.

  • JofreyRice

    You’re guessing wrong, I don’t read Philly.com at all. Never said Foles was “winning”, in fact, I said that neither of them is really pulling away, they’re still splitting reps. You can have your theories about why they are splitting reps, and what will change in the future, but as of right now, it’s just conjecture. Do you know of any camp reports that have Vick way out in front? Just about every outlet has reported on good days for each of them.

    Kelly’s been true to what he said when he brought Vick back. In your mind, Vick’s superior talent should have been enough to bury Foles in the first few days, but that hasn’t happened, according to any of the sources.

  • Richard Colton

    why not? he can play in the league. You need at least two, and some teams don’t have one.

    As far as shining on the Eagles? Maybe in the short term.

    I’m concerned with Superbowl first and I’m assuming that run will be ’15 – no earlier than ’14. I’m OK with Vick starting if he either 1) Clearly outplays Foles in preseason or 2) the coaching staff doesn’t feel that Foles is the QB in ’14 or ’15. There’s really no point in playing Vick if the staff thinks Foles is the guy moving forward.

  • #7

    Exactly

  • #7

    Did it ever occur to you that they’re installing a new offense? New scheme? If that is the case, shouldn’t Foles be blowing out Vick since you people say that Foles is so much better than Vick after 6 starts?

  • #7

    Nick Foles ain’t wiping nothing but his own a$#

  • JofreyRice

    Vick has been horrible in the preseason the last couple years, so we’ll have to see. I don’t think either of them is really distinguishing himself–and I don’t think it’s because they’re both playing at equally high levels.

    My POV has, and will continue to be, that the Eagles franchise QB is not on the roster, yet.

  • JofreyRice

    Who is “you people”? I’ve been plenty critical of Foles, too.

    It’s fine that they’re installing a new offense, but if you have one QB that’s obviously much better than the other, you don’t split the reps evenly. Is Trestman splitting reps evenly between Jay Cutler & Josh McCown? Come on, Vick has built up less job security than Brandon Weeden, to this point.

  • #7

    That is the way that the organizationwanted it and the performanceof the team = re-evaluate the QB position. QB gets all the praise and blame. Unfortunately, this is the way it is.

    I see nothing wrong with competition. That’s the NFL

  • #7

    What I mean by “you people” I’m referring to you Foles fans. Nothing racial at all

  • #7

    Like Chris Berman says, “that’s why they play the games”

  • illadelphia21

    Totally agree. Here’s what I don’t get though…yes Vick has been trending way down the last couple years and he’s never been a good “practice player” (this includes preseason).. So why has not Foles just taken command of this comp? I mean I don’t think he’s very good, to begin w/, but I thought this would be his perfect scenario.

  • #7

    Foles in shorts was “supposed” to be better than Vick. And he still can’t pull away. Now, like I jofreyrice, they are splitting reps. Maybe that is the reason. All I know from what I’ve read, Vick has been better with pads in 11 on 11 drills

  • JofreyRice

    My honest answer for why neither of them has pulled away is that they’re both kind of crappy. I have a hard time seeing either of them “shining” this year.

  • Dutch

    Any Quarterback put behind the same offensive line as Vick would have had the same problems and inefficiencies. There is no way to discount the effects of what’s going on around a QB and how it effects his game. Play calling with a depleted Offensive Line is the beginning and end of that discussion.

    Andy killed Vick as he did Foles putting both behind that line to set up more than 40 times a game. Even Shady was put on the rack running behind that line.

  • defroe

    8 games is not a real chance or shot to take over the team you sir are a vick fan and unable to give foles a chance.

  • JofreyRice

    Nothing wrong with competition, but why did the org. want competition in the first place? It ain’t because Vick’s been killing it for the past 2 years. And he’s not “shining” in this competition, so far, either.

  • #7

    According to nj.com he is.

  • JofreyRice

    Here’s the first line of Ranaan’s latest piece on Vick vs. Foles:

    http://www.nj.com/eagles/index.ssf/2013/08/michael_vick_vs_nick_foles_its_vicks_day_to_shine.html

    “Back and forth they go. When they stop, nobody (not even Chip Kelly) knows….Michael Vick and Nick Foles alternate days of brilliance.”

    Hard to make that read like Vick is killing Foles in the comp.

    So according to Jordan they’re both “brilliant”. I find that a little hard to believe.

  • #7

    Take it as you will sir

  • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

    Foles has ONLY looked good in shorts. ONLY. He has yet to have a day in pads where he really looked good.

    I’m not sure what people expect from Vick in camp. It’s camp and they’re still installing the offense. And since pads have been on most folk (even the ones with obvious bias) have said the same thing – Vick looks sharp. And that’s with him occasionally hitting the fly swatters.

  • JofreyRice

    Fine, but I’m not even a Foles fan.

  • #7

    Not so sure about that

  • JofreyRice

    Why, because I’m not buying into the absurd notion that Vick is some slamdunk to “shine” after the team benched him for a 3rd round rookie, cut half his salary, and put him in an open competition–one that’s still unsettled, by the way?

    Are you actually an Eagles fan, or do you just follow Vick?

  • #7

    Well, to be accurate he wasn’t benched, he was injured as was our season. That’s what teams do when they are out of contention. They play the younger players, but you Foles fans want to count that as Vick being “benched”. Let’s just keep this honest JofreyRice.
    It is a new regime. They are starting over and having competition at multiple positions. Sure, I imagine #7 would like to be the uncontested starter, but if the team does not perform around the QB, he gets the blame, hence the QB competition.
    That’s fine with me. VIck is a competitor and obviously he isn’t backing down fron the “challenge” that Foles brings. If Foles wins, good for him, but I doubt it. Foles is a backup and the WRs that we have do not mesh well with him because Foles cannot consistently hit on the deeper passes. Sure he can do it in shorts apparently, but as we’ve seen, now when it counts..hence the 1-5 record when he started.
    So you’re willing to bet on Foles after last year? Also, this “competition” is happening because they do not believe Foles is the answer or Vick would be gone and Foles would be the unquestioned starter.
    Sounds like you want to build for the future, and I say f that. We already have talent. We can win this year if Vick starts and we have some health/defense/protection. Hmmm…that’s what every team needs to win in this league. What a coincidence

  • Always Hopeful

    I am what my screen name is, but I also am able to look at the team i am a fan of objectively (is that possible?) and I agree that I don’t see either one of them “shining” for different reasons. I do believe that they will both have the capacity to be serviceable so that the Eagles win more than 4 games (I know, going out on a big limb with that prediction)

    I’ll also say that whoever starts for the Eagles will get better as the season goes on. Not that they will be at Pro Bowl level, but progression is the goal.

    I hope Kelly is able to usher in a new Golden Age and we’ll look back at the names Vick and Foles like we look back at Doug Pedersen (was that his name?) and remember the initial growing pains of learning how to win consistently.

  • Richard Colton

    true. I don’t think I’m drinking the cool aid when I say the Eagles could go from worst to first in the NFC East. But they aren’t winning the superbowl this year. 2 years away minimum – and that’s with a lot of things breaking right.

  • Dutch

    Foles doesn’t have the zip to hit common 10 yd out patterns, so what exactly is his strengths? He can’t hit the long ball 20 yds or more consistently. Given Kelly plays to his QB strengths, if Foles were his QB what other than handing the ball to running backs can Foles do in the NFL?

    We are seeing the same failures to hit common routes in camp out of Foles we saw in his 7 appearance in 2012. On intermediate and short routes, he’s slow and ball floats and defenders tip and intercept his passes, he can’t hit the streaking receivers deep and he doesn’t put zip on the ball to hit any out pattern with a 5 or 7 step drop. What are his strengths as some of you see them, and please don’t say it’s reading NFL defenses because he comes up short in that department after telegraphing his throws and steering down is receivers.

    What are his strengths?

  • Dutch

    There isn’t a QB in the league who without protections up front can give you his best production and stay healthy.

    This isn’t fantasy football. For all it’s worth the game of Football in the NFL is still won in the trenches you only go as far as your Offensive and Defensive line takes you. Over the last two season Vick although he’s not played 16 games in either season still was punished and hit in that pocket over 120 time each season. That’s not counting the hits on Foles who replaced Vick when he went out with an concussion.

    How is it you guys had not learned that lesson from Andy Reid it beyond the pale.

  • Johnny Domino

    Thanks, I’m sponsored by Bounty.
    “The quicker picker-upper!”

  • knighn

    Thanks, Chip. Whether or not these guys are franchise QBs is only part of the question. The other part: what is their ceiling? We have a pretty good idea that Vick won’t be around after 2015. We have a pretty good idea that the Eagles are going to need to find their franchise QB. This is a guy that is either going to come from the current roster, the 2014 draft or the 2015 draft. The Eagles are also going to need backup QBs, someone capable of winning a game or two in case the starter goes down. If neither Barkley nor Foles are even capable of being backups, then the Eagles need three new QBs in the next two years. Once again: I don’t see the point in letting Vick finish out the downside of his career with an Eagles team that is not ready to contend versus determining the future of the team at the most important position.

  • knighn

    7 GAMES versus 9 SEASONS as a starter.
    1 GAME missed is not enough to establish a trend. 8 out of 9 SEASONS where the player misses one or more games: that’s a very clear pattern.

  • Token

    Vick has looked bad in pads for 9 years.

    Why do you few Vick disciples want to act as though his entire career up to this point has not actually happened and it was just some dream? Are you from Newport News? Are you Marcus Vick? I cant think of any other reason a rational person would want to watch this guy anymore.

    I think for most of us this isnt a Vick vs Foles conversation. Its a Vick vs any other QB in the world. Im just done watching Vick. I have had more then my fill. Hes a bad QB that has always been the same player and somehow you people expect him to change. Id rather watch literally anyone else play QB this year.

    Id rather not waste yet another year of my favorite past time watching Michael Vick.

  • defroe81

    sorry but your bias is pretty obvious as well booty person…

  • defroe81

    esselc didnt even mention foles in his post is the funny part you are just hell bent on proving that vick is better than foles. you would never give foles a real chance. pocket presence and mobility with in it are two. but whatever bro vick will win the job and you will be happy happy joy joy boy good for you.

  • defroe81

    oh lord ok well hopefully the line is back to its 2011 2010 form which amounted to much of nothing and vick can prove all his haters wrong i trully hope he does. vick won me over again with his handling of the cooper situation. im rooting for him im just not sure it will happen…