Twitter Mailbag: Great Expectations For Foles

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A change of pace today. There were a couple questions posed on 97.5 The Fanatic’s timeline that caught my eye, so I decided to run with them.

From @975TheFanatic: YES or NO? MT @phillysport: Nick Foles 14 career starts, @LesBowen says greatness is already expected of him. Fair?

Foles went 30-of-48 for 428 yards with three touchdowns and an interception in a 48-30 loss to Minnesota. (Just realized the final score and Foles’ completion numbers are the same. This guy is a wizard.) He finished with a 103.5 quarterback rating. Les points out that if Foles had this kind of outing a few months back, we would be lauding him. Now, “we’re looking for greatness” and therefor are more critical.


I think there is some of that going on. Because Foles set the bar so high with his early work, we may look at a few misfires over the course of the game and be too quick to call him "off." It says a lot about the kind of year that he is having that he can complete 63 percent of his throws and toss three touchdowns and the general consensus is that Foles did not bring his 'A' game. That is also a byproduct of watching this team so closely. If you scan the boxscores and see that Russell Wilson threw for three scores and was picked once, say, you'll conclude that he had a good day and move on. It's different when you critique every snap.

On the other hand, such scrutiny can bring some truths to light. Foles was streaky in this game. He was off  at times (including in some key moments), then would catch fire. He held onto the ball too long on a few occassions. And, he was operating against a depleted defense that ranked 30th in the NFL in pass yards allowed/game and had yielded a league-high 29 touchdowns through the air.

If you were looking for greatness on Mall Of America Field Sunday, you didn't find it. If you were looking for pretty good overall play out of a promising young quarterback, you walked away generally pleased. As in many things, it's about perspective.

He's probably getting overly-scrutinized, but the same is true for many QBs across the NFL. Comes with the territory.

From @HARRYMAYES975: Was Sunday's loss...just one bad game for a young, growing team OR a more real indication of who they are as a team?

Good one, Harry.

In some ways, the Eagles played over their heads during their recent run. Foles wasn't going to have a perfect touchdown-interception ratio for his entire career. And no one predicted this defense would limit its opponents to 21 points or less for nine consecutive games. Just a really remarkable stretch, both by the quarterback and the defense.

Credit the coaching staff for getting the most out of their players. Anytime an individual or unit is crushing expectations, chances are quality coaching is at least partially responsible for it. Chip Kelly, Billy Davis, quarterbacks coach Bill Lazor and defensive line/assistant head coach Jerry Azzinaro lead the list of those who should be recognized for their work.

I believe in the offense. Even if Foles is cooling off a little, I still think he'll be effective. He is a good decision-maker and if you can make the right reads in this scheme with these playmakers, good things will continue to happen for you.

The defense is more of a concern. Davis has found ways to mask vulnerabilities, particularly in the secondary, but Sunday was a reminder that those vulnerabilities still remain.

"We've said all along we have so much work to do. This is Year One," said Davis. "We've had some success -- a lot of success that was probably unexpected -- but still the weaknesses weren't any...nothing has really changed. We just continue to try and get better as we go."

To Harry's original question, I do think Sunday is a true reflection of who this team is, just as I believe the previous five games were. That is, they are a well-coached, young team capable of soaring to great heights yet susceptible to big letdowns. Kelly is a rookie head coach that has many things figured out, but not everything. He doesn't have all the personnel pieces in place yet.

It's early in the build, and they are susceptible to breakdowns. The trick will be trying to avoid them over the next couple weeks.

  • joeknowsnada

    Eagles are ahead of schedule and playing with “house money.” Anything they do/did, from Week 8 or so, on, was/is gravy, IMO. Sunday was a clunker, it happens. If Foles played perfectly, it might have been closer, but, since coaching was at fault, and DEE could not stop Cassel, we were going to lose just about no matter what Foles came up with.

    Sunday showed us how thin our secondary is, continues to be. We lost Boykin, and that started the problem. We need Boykin, Fletcher and Williams to be healthy and play well, to win against good or hot QBs. Boykin is, at times, a ballhawk and maybe if he is in there, some of those deep passes are INTs, or are batted down. If we play Dallas for the division, we need some “Shields”-type coverage, and Boykin can provide closing speed in those situations. We need Nate Allen to play solid safety, and we need to get Earl Wolff back in there asap.

    • Chris

      can’t get Wolff back fast enough IMO

  • aub32

    Ok I tried being nice up until now because I did not wnt to give off the impression that I enjoyed the fact that we lost. For the record, I absolutely did not. However, Foles getting this pass that he played well is ridiculous. He had a few luck throws against a terrible defense, and his teammates bailed him out with great catches and even better performances after the catch. He blew at least 3 TDs and several chances to sustain drives. He clearly was late to DJax turning what should have been a TD into an INT. He threw a stupid block that cost DJax another TD, and some of you wonder why the guy was pissed. Let’s not forget how he thought he was Cam Newton and decided to pull it down instead of giving it to the best back in the league on 4th and 1, or how he took the sack on 3rd and 1. Give me a break. The guy is a bum. He was Foles gold and now he’s turning back into a pumpkin joining the ranks of Kolb and Matt Flynn. Kelly will not be fooled into locking up Foles and making him his his guy. Just you all watch :)

    • D-von

      You are an idiot

      • aub32

        That’s not nice.

    • Chris

      I don’t think anyone will disagree that Foles missed a few plays, but how can you honestly believe the last third or so of your post? If he HAD hit every pass he would’ve ended up with something like 40-48 for 500yds and 5TDs, how can you honestly say that you expect that out of anyone every week and if they don’t produce perfectly they are “a bum”. The D is what let us down this week, 30 points on offense should be enough to win a game. I’m not sitting here lauding him as the second coming of Peyton, but the kid had us on a 5 game win streak in which he was near perfect, and it’s only his second season. He has done nothing to suggest (to me at least) that he doesn’t deserve a shot next year. No Foles the last two months = no playoff run, period. I’d rather enjoy the success we’re having and keep building with a serviceable QB in Foles than waste a high draft pick on an unknown. What would be your alternative option to Foles?

      • aub32

        That’s a very rational argument, and I don’t disagree.

      • OregonDucker

        Once Chip’s O starts hitting on all cylinders, the Eagles will scare every team in the NFL. They are very close. Once they finally get it, a mediocre D will not matter. (I speak from experience watching Chip’s teams.)

      • Maggie

        It’s not much different than blaming Romo every time the Dallas D lets in 37 points while the Dallas O scores only 31, lol.

        • knighn

          Yikes. I’ve been away too long.

          Like it or not: when a QB throws two picks in the final 4 minutes of a game after years as the franchise QB, and when the first of those two INTs was supposed to be a run play (to help run out the clock) and Romo checked out of it, because, you know, he’s a freaking genius of a QB, then Yes: this is an incredible run-on sentence and Romo deserves a hefty, hefty, HEFTY dose of blame. Oh, and when that QB already has a heavy reputation for choking and moving to a little place I call “FAILSVILLE” every time December rolls around, then yes: that QB deserves to be blamed.

          And if that’s not a good enough reason to blame him: Remember he is a stupid Dallas Cowboy and that he has that Stupid Face that makes you want to punch him every time you see him.

          Sometimes I think you’re too nice to be an Eagles fan.

    • James Hathaway

      Bum is a bit harsh. Fact is, he was 1/4 of a second late on the DJax throw. The block was a good effort/team play, but he didn’t know the rule. That’s on the coach. He wasn’t Oakland hot, but he was a hell of a lot better than he played against Dallas. If this is Foles week in and week out, I’ll take it. He absolutely has the potential to be a top 10 QB. Especially if we take pressure off of him by running more often with a top 3 back in football.

    • jabostick

      You really think Foles was the reason we lost?

      • aub32

        Foles could have played better. He could have put up more points and at the very least gotten a few 1st downs that would have kept the defense off of the field. He wasn’t as terrible as my post suggests. That was for play. However, I think people forgot that our D is our weakness. The offense is going to have to cover up for them. Foles failed in that regard, and it had more to do with him being inaccurate and hesitant than facing a good D. So he was not the “reason”, but he does get quite a bit of the blame in my opinion.

        • OregonDucker

          Oregon’s O more than compensated for a weak D in some years. I honestly think Chip can pull this off in the NFL this year. We will see in the next few games. If the O can learn from their mistakes, the Eagles will be scary good.

          • aub32

            Considering how Chip had Foles playing after the Dallas game, I don’t doubt it. I still fear the Bears though. It’s hard to ask Foles or anyone to be flawless. One mistake could make all the difference. My problem with Foles in the Minne game is that he made much more than one or two mistakes, despite putting up pretty good numbers.

          • OregonDucker

            I am convinced he was confused by the mixed coverage schemes. Delayed his throws which he then had to hurry. It was an important lesson for a young QB and new coach.

          • aub32

            I am hoping to see the two bounce back strong against the Bears.

        • jabostick

          That falls under the rational/reasonable argument section. Your first post doesnt, imo

          • Andy124

            First post was a playful troll job.

          • jabostick

            Fair enough, and well-executed. Though that sounds like the equivalent of an athlete saying his twitter account got hacked haha. I’ll give him a pass though because the royal canadian mounted police start serving warnings if a Canadian gets to worked up on a message board

          • aub32

            My first post was me having a little fun. I won’t be able to post for a while since I’m going on vacation. So I figured I’d see if I could make Geag explode.

          • nicksaenz1

            Wish I had this info in advance. Happy I didn’t respond with anything other than Hi hater.

          • aub32

            I put in a smiley. I’ve been told it’s a dead give away that “I’m kidding”.

          • nicksaenz1

            I responded above: totally skipped it. Word on the street is it means exactly that.

          • OregonDucker

            Thermonuclear explosions are not a good thing – too much collateral damage!! :-)

    • GEAGLE

      I don’t understand why people miss Dutch when we still have idiots like you?

      • aub32

        Again not very polite.

        • GEAGLE

          I prefer being real, over being polite…sorry but I don’t believe in censoring Thruths

          • aub32

            There’s no truth in name calling, especially when you can’t even see why you are wrong. Go ask Rob. Maybe he can help you out.

          • GEAGLE

            Name calling? You called FOles a bum, I called you an idiot???if the shoe fits! what’s the problem? Now if I called you a brilliant poster, you should take offense to that, because it would be a “name calling” lie…..if you enjoy 8th place trophies, and people pissing in your ear and telling you it’s rain, then apologies…if you appreciate honesty, then you are consistently a MORON

          • aub32

            O I’m sorry. Are you Foles? Is Foles really a bum? No. That’s clearly an exaggeration. Foles is a QB in the NFL. So he is obviously not standing on a corner begging for change. It’s funny that you prefer name calling over actual discussion. However, I will take your inability to form an argument as a lack of your ability to do so. Plus you’re still missing the point of my post. Don’t worry. I will give time for others to fill you in.

          • theycallmerob

            leave my name out of this, you terrorist

      • nicksaenz1

        We both know Dutch’s post would have been way more fun to read.

        • GEAGLE

          Fair!! But he is consistently a close second

          • nicksaenz1

            Everything Dutch would have said would have been as asinine if not more so, but the way it would have been worded is invaluable. There’s no one like the Dutch-master, and never will be. I pray for his return.

          • GEAGLE

            Smoked that fool like my Dutch…ashes!! RIP DUTCH!!!

            I’m gonna start a graveyard…Dutch tombstone wll be my first..working on Aub next…until my graveyard is filled with Vick idiots…sort of how Dana white built a graveyard room for all the UFCs rival companies that he bought off and then buried :)

    • G_WallyHunter

      upvote for the audacity

      • GEAGLE

        Lol

      • aub32

        LOL

      • OregonDucker

        Heehee. SMH

      • Andy124

        You mispelled aubdacity.

        • aub32

          HAHAHA Nice.

        • G_WallyHunter

          Damn, that was a good one

    • jabostick

      One man’s “bailed out with great catches and eevn better performances after the catch” is another man’s “puts his teammates in a position to make plays”. If the bet is whether he becomes Flynn or Kolb, I’ll happily take that action

    • nicksaenz1

      Hi hater!

      • GEAGLE

        Hi HATER it is!!!!

      • G_WallyHunter

        he needs some Haterade

        • GEAGLE

          Thirsty mofo

        • nicksaenz1

          haters wanna hate, lovers wanna love, I don’t even want, none of the above…

      • jabostick

        Hate hate hate hate….

        • theycallmerob

          one of the best skits there was…..

    • Phyxius

      I voted you down. :)

      • aub32

        Uhhh…..Thanks. I’m not sure how to respond to that.

    • Adam

      But I see your true colors
      Shining through
      I see your true colors
      And that’s why I love you
      So don’t be afraid to let them show
      Your true colors
      True colors are beautiful,
      Like a rainbow

      • Maggie

        Your Eagle almost looks like it’s walking on water! :]

        • Andy124

          Just like Nick. :)

    • Jason

      Ha, that will get the natives going.

      Foles may have some limitations, but so does every QB. He is by far and away the best option on the roster and gives this team a chance to win every game. I would continue but I’m sure GEagle will have plenty of hyperbole for you.

      • GEAGLE

        Nah…he really isn’t worth it…I gave him a few jabs, bent him over my lap, gave him the belt and sent him on his way…his shtick isn’t even original…fake ass dutch knock off

        • Jason

          Ha, fair enough

      • aub32

        LOL I think I broke him. He’s given up telling me how great Foles is in favor of throwing out every insult he can think of. I think I made him mad lol

        • Joe

          You remind me of my 10 year old brother playing Call of Duty.

    • Kev_H

      Happy for you that you got that off your chest. Beyond that your post makes no sense at all. Foles played a solid game, I guess you forget about the drops, including DJax drop, because the QB accepts that as part of the game and doesn’t whine to the press how his receivers let him down.

      • Phyxius

        That’s what I love about Foles, he makes no excuses.

    • Andy124

      Holy crap! There’s a smiley at the end, aub’s account has been hacked!

      If it wasn’t so close to what he was already saying yesterday, I’d assume he was making a joke. Maybe he is. That, or he’s just gone full Dutch on us.

      • Chris

        you never go full Dutch.

      • aub32

        Thanks 124. Maybe you can get Geag off the ledge. This is my last week in the US for a bit, and I thought I’d have a little fun and see what this smiley thing is all about. I may not have completely bought into FOles, but he is far from a bum. It’s a shame that so many would rather name call than see the smilely or at least present an argument. It wouldn’t even be hard to argue.

        • Andy124

          I’m pretty impressed. I really wasn’t positive you were joking at all. Well done.

          • aub32

            I had to sell it which is why I included things that could really be taken as arguments I’d make. I thought the whole bum thing would tip me off. I’ve never been that harsh on Foles. However, I included the smiley just in case. Funny how many people missed it.

          • nicksaenz1

            Skipped right past it haha

          • Andy124

            The “I’ve been trying to be nice” bit made the rest really believable. If not for the smiley, I’d have bit hook, line and sinker. I half bit as it was.

          • aub32

            I figured that part would draw people in since there are many who think I detest Foles. Though I knew i was going to need a smiley or else no one would even believe me after I revealed it was a joke.

        • OregonDucker

          rec for coming clean. Fans are pissed and worried – things could get really ugly.

        • theycallmerob

          I don’t think anyone can get Geag off the ledge.
          And for the record, you stole my “turn back into pumpkin” line from the ol’ Dutch’s Take.
          Will you be able to catch Vick’s games from wherever you’re going?

          • aub32

            I knew I saw that pumpkin line somewhere. I think Foles will play against Dallas, but I wouldn’t mind us getting to sit our starters and seeing Vick put on a show one last time in Eagles green. I enjoyed him as a player and person, but Foles is our guy going forward. And my friend has the NFL package over in the UK so I will get to see the game no matter who starts.

          • theycallmerob

            ah, good, at least you’ll have english-speaking announcers.
            enjoy your travels.

          • aub32

            Thanks, and I never thought about that. Yea that is good then.

    • OregonDucker

      We need counter arguments on St. Nick even in jest. Your points are well taken. Nonetheless, St. Nick is the franchise QB for Philly. No doubt whatsoever.

      • aub32

        Thanks for paying attention.

    • Tom w

      Dope.

    • theycallmerob

      ….did Dutch steal your handle for this one? nice

    • Richard Colton

      amazing. Troll post of the year. Well done. (spoiler to new people – Aub does NOT feel this way)

    • Joe

      Are you Marcus Vick? You can type coherent sentences so I don’t think so. Just a guy that really, really hates Foles I guess.

  • Daniel Norman Richwine

    Nick Foles has certainly proved he can be a good starting QB in the league. That makes him better at his job than almost everyone else in the world is at theirs. Maybe not good enough for Chip, but still an extremely valuable part of any team.

    • GEAGLE

      Not good enough from Chip? This crap still exists?

      • Daniel Norman Richwine

        Keep an open mind, my friend. If Chip decides Foles is less Tom Brady and more Alex Smith, who are we to gainsay him? Time will tell.

        • GEAGLE

          Blah blah…FOles will be here, get used it

  • John J. King

    Imagine what things will be like if this kind of game is his low point! He was fuzzy at times but the numbers don’t lie and if the ‘D’ hadn’t become unglued; if they had better field position and Nick didn’t forget the blocking rules ( a huge error, in my opinion because it changed the psychology), we’d all be laughing today.

  • Adam

    A lot of the high expectations come from Vick fans waiting for a chance to pounce on Foles as soon as he has a bad game. And the funny thing is this is the best they can do.

    • Chris

      happening already, shots fired.

    • G_WallyHunter

      high expectations/unwarranted criticism lol yes, very much so.

    • GEAGLE

      Comical ain’t it…

      Jermey bloom coud do what Vick does lol

      • nicksaenz1

        So could Orlando Bloom…?

        • GEAGLE

          Lol he is probably about as durable

    • http://julianivey.com/ Julian Ivey

      That’s crazy to me. I just want to win and could care-less about who the QB is but I’m an out-of-town fan so I’m sure this is a much bigger topic in-town.

      • Adam

        For some people, they’re watching the Eagles because they’re Vick fans, not because they’re Eagles fans.

        • morgan c

          aub32, bigbutt, ahem ahem…

          • nicksaenz1

            #7??

          • Richard Colton

            on the other thread. A poster made a statement about WAR (baseball stat) applied to Foles – I asked him if he thought Vick would have the same success as Foles had he not been injured. 7′s response:

            “Would be the same, if not better. And if not, Vick would be benched. Simple as that.”

          • nicksaenz1

            WAR stands for Wins Above Replacement, and Vick’s replacement has 7 more wins than Vick… ironic?

          • Richard Colton

            the Vick crowd came out of hiding, and all it took was a miserable 400 yard passing day by Foles for them to pounce.

          • Bdawkbdawk

            That poster was me. I brought it up because Foles’ 400 yard day vastly overstated his performance. It ignores the horrendous defense, the scheme, and circumstance (it is easier to throw against a D playing a soft zone shell up 20)
            I think league average QB play would have matched or exceeded Foles’ production. I don’t think this is controversial. Sheil’s comment about a good Foles getting 600 yards comes to mind.
            But if it’s easier for you to mis-portray me as a Vick supporter, well go for it. Lately you haven’t let facts get in the way of your comments anyway.

          • theycallmerob

            dude seriously, WTF is wrong with you today? between just posting “dope” and other rants about dumb fans, you’ve really impressed.

            Try this post on for size: it asks the very question you seem so sure of.
            http://igglesblitz.com/2013/12/switching-places/

          • Bdawkbdawk

            Whatre you talking about? I read the piece by Tommy, it was well thought out. I want to know something similar. When I watched the game on Sunday I wasn’t happy with Foles’ performance. In the past I have been very happy with his performance. I merely stated this and had Foles megafans come from far and wide to criticize me for questioning Foles.
            I feel like this has changed to a different site overnight.

          • Richard Colton

            you’re kidding. re-read the above post. You were only referenced to provide context to what #7 said. His point was incorrect but interesting. Yours was neither.

          • Bdawkbdawk

            I reread it and I see the same thing as before. I clarified my position on what I thought about Foles because of nicksaenz1′s comment about Vick and your subsequent post that reads.
            “the Vick crowd came out of hiding, and all it took was a miserable 400 yard passing day by Foles for them to pounce”
            I am not one of the Vick crowd and I do not think that replacing Foles with Vick would be a good decision. But again keep up with the snippy remarks about me being both incorrect and uninteresting.
            As long as you reference my posts and then use the pronoun “him” you cast apsersions on my comments through ambiguous pronouns.

          • Richard Colton

            Dude, get over yourself. You haven’t made a good point yet today. You’re not a Vick guy? OK. I never said you were. #7 is, and he responded to you.

          • Bdawkbdawk

            Nor have you. You’ve been coming at me all day for a fairly innocuous point. I respond to comment you made that was ambiguous and you tell me to “get over myself.” What is wrong with you?

          • Dustan M. Howell

            LOL, football is a team game. Teams win games, not individual players. We didn’t exactly face stellar opponents during that five game winning streak. All you Foles-lovers are pointing out how bad the defense was yesterday, but you Foles lovers sure as hell didn’t call out the defense when Vick was playing. You know, when we were ranked 32nd ? The difference has been the defense, not the quarterback. Up until yesterday, our defense was ranked 13th. The defense didn’t give up more that 21 points for six straight weeks, so yes, we would have the same record with Vick. Actually, our record ( instead of 8-6) might be 9-5. Say what you want about Vick, but you’d be lying if you said that you think he would have laid an egg, against Dallas, that stunk as bad as the Foles laid that day.

            As far as Foles’s performance yesterday, yes he had over 423 yards, but we were behind by a lot. QBs tend to rack up lots of yards when losing big because the opponent’s D concedes a lot of underneath stuff and the QB is throwing more than usual. Also, per Pro Football Focus, 233 of Foles’s 423 Yards came after the catch. The last TD pass was also a garbage time TD. This is why you can’t solely rely on the stat line.

            Foles was clearly struggling yesterday. He was wildly inaccurate, took sacks when he should’ve thrown the ball away, held the ball too long, killing drives,which is something Foles lovers killed Vick for but overlook it with Foles.

            But people are being too harsh when they point that out,LOL !!!

          • Nicholas Disilvestro

            Marcus Hayes, is that you?

          • #7

            To them, it’s not a team game when Vick is at QB. All of the focus was totally on Vick’s performance…against the two best teams in the NFL at that point of the season. Every team that FOles has beat had a star(s) missing. No AP, Rodgers, etc. WOW how lucky is that. I stand by what I said in a different thread. The results would be the same if not better with Vick. He would be benched if otherwise and I would have been fine with that. And McCoy would probably have 1500 yards if not more at this point. And not saying that McCoy can’t run without Vick. The man will get his yards regardless.

            Trust me man, defense was hardly even mentioned when Vick was at QB and our D was on their way to being the worst in NFL history. They overlook a lot of things on Foles because he’s “young” and “inexperienced”. Now they say he’s being critiqued too harshly LOL.

            They have already anointed Foles as the greatest….but I’m just not convinced. You need a QB that can make a dynamic throw here and there and Foles CANNOT make those throws. Foles cannot escape the rush when no one is open, hence the 4 sacks against the Vikes. Foles was CLEARLY struggling, but of course, it was overlooked lol.

            “He had 400 yards and 3TDs!!”

            Yep, in garbage time. Foles saved by YAC. Then, it’s all on the defense, not Foles. It’s never Foles fault on here. They are drunk on the kool-aid man, but the will be punched in the face with reality real soon.

          • Dustan M. Howell

            Foles has been saved by YAC and great plays on the ball by his receivers in basically all of his wins. Against the Bucs, a good number of his passes were behind the LOS. Against the Raiders, their secondary couldn’t stay on their feet or remember who to cover. Against GB, with out Rodgers ( or Wallace) Foles completed 12 passes, several of those passes were screens caught behind the LOS, and two of his TD passes should have been interceptions or incompletions. Against Washington he threw for almost 300 yards, but again, he benefited from lots of YAC his receivers and couldn’t do jack for the majority of the second half. Against the Cardinals, one of his TDs came from a very short field. Another came off of a PI penalty where we got the ball on the one yard line, and the other came of a nice drive lead by Foles. After that, all the offense did with Foles was punt. He couldn’t close out the game and almost gave it away. Against Detroit, he was dreadful for half of the game; then in the 2nd half he throws a nice deep pass to Cooper and then badly overthrows Cooper in the endzone, but the pass goes right to Jackson. Shady did the rest after that.

            It’s Chip’s scheme that’s getting players in space in order to get all that YAC. Honestly, I don’t think Chip wants to put that much on Foles’s plate. The offense looks like a college offense with Foles in there. There are a lot more screens that are thrown with Foles in there. It’s basically get the receivers in space and let them work, and then when the defense comes up to stop all that YAC, let Foles take a shot deep against one on one match ups. With Vick, our offense looked more like an NFL offense that was rarely under center, and rarely huddled. There were short, intermediate, and deep routes.

            What happens when teams have a whole year of tape to adjust to Chip’s scheme ? We’re going to need a QB that can fit the ball in tight windows and tight man coverage. Foles has yet to do that.

          • #7

            Amen

          • Joe

            AKA the people who are barely around any more.

          • #7

            Right here buddy

          • aub32

            I was an Eagles fan long before Vick and will remain one long after. Sorry. You’re stuck with me.

          • Phyxius

            You’re stuck with Foles :(

          • aub32

            Why the sad face. There are much worse options than Foles.

          • theycallmerob

            hey, at least we don’t have shah over here too much. One thing to hate Foles, another level of crazy altogether to want to replace him with Joe Webb.

          • cliff henny

            have to check out some of tommy’s post…bet shah is throwing daggers

          • theycallmerob

            I’m avoiding those comments for the week. mostly great, but man his posts….

          • theycallmerob

            never mind. just made it there. the new article, switching places….shah is off his meds today. Went full dutch.

          • Nicholas Disilvestro

            Where is bigbutt? I stopped coming to this blog for a bit because her and dutch were starting to have adverse effects on my blood pressure

          • Adam

            You actually thought she’d stick around after Foles took over? She pops her big butt out once in awhile when Foles struggles but for the most part she’s gone.

          • Richard Colton

            I heard she signed up for Cure Auto Insurance just to feel closer to him.

          • Nicholas Disilvestro

            LOL

          • theycallmerob

            man, one day when I had waaaaay too many beers, I clicked on her blog link in her profile. if that isn’t a giveaway about whether she liked Vick or football, I don’t know what is

          • Adam

            Yeah me too. I’ve got some pretty crazy sex moves down now though.

          • Andy124

            She’s over at IB, upvoting all of shah’s posts. No, not kidding.

    • OregonDucker

      Foles will be scary good again. You could see it in the Bears game but most likely in the Cowgirls game. I really believe he will destroy the Cowgirls D- he has something to prove there.

      • nicksaenz1

        Maybe he’ll sign the locker room wall and go on to win a ring…

    • Bdawkbdawk

      Well, the Dallas game was pretty bad. This game was not a good showing. I think the unwillingness to critique Foles after this average showing, is because people do not evaluate Foles by the same standards that they did Vick (for whatever the reasons).
      It’s a shame really, because if you did, you would still come away with the impression that Foles is better. However, you wouldn’t have to engage in silly distractions to avoid admitting that above average QB play could have stolen that game for us.

      • Andy124

        Totally disagree.
        1) Everybody is critiquing Foles. Even those defending him. There were plenty of mistakes to notice.
        2) The issue becomes when you roll it all up and slap a label on this performance, some of the final grades being handed out are ridiculous.
        3) If Foles were held to the standards Vick was held to, he’d be ordained as the GOAT.

        • Bdawkbdawk

          He should be critiqued because of Sunday. If he had switched jerseys with Matt Cassell prior to kickoff, we would have won. Obviously atypical performances from both QBs, but for godsakes, when you get outplayed by Matt Cassell, you should take some heat.

          • Andy124

            Spock does not approve your post. Completely illogical.

          • Bdawkbdawk

            Not sure what you mean by that, but sure I’ll take the bait. Let’s be logical. In what areas is the Vikings’ offense superior to the Eagles’ offense? Anyone?….Anyone? We had a better RB, better WRS (if you loook at yearly production), and most likely a better Oline (subject to argument).
            Our defenses are similiarly incompetent. Almost to a fault.
            Now let me ask you, who is a better coach, Chip or Leslie?
            Foles’s pick was because of a bad decision and an underthrow. Cassel’s was a product of a tipped ball at the line and a great play by Kendricks. Foles took more sacks and the sacks were in more damaging areas of the field. Cassell made more intermediate throws to WRs in space. Foles made a couple more over the top throws and a ton of screens and drag routes. How can you, with a modicum of integrity, say that my previous post was illogical?

          • Andy124

            Not sure what you mean by that

            1) Changing the standard you judge our quarterback by based on how the other quarterback plays is completely illogical.
            2) Assuming that Matt Cassell can be represented by a constant value, and low one at that is completely illogical. Human performance is highly variable, and Cassell’s performance was outstanding on Sunday, which combined with our defense playing horribly and led to 48 points. None of which were scored with Foles on the field.

          • Bdawkbdawk

            Seeing as this is a zero sum sport and not a long drive competition, I don’t see the problem with expecting a presumably superior QB to outperform a lousy QB. Especially when that presumably superior QB seems to have a much more favorable matchup. The Vikings put up 48 on us. We should have, and could have, put up as many on them if Foles had played well.
            Performances are not context independent and people don’t get rewarded for good tries. I have never heard a Philadelphia fan praise Vick in a loss. Nor McNabb for that matter.
            Again, not saying Foles is bad, or that we should change our QB or anything stupid like that. It’s just silly that people are sitting here saying “Foles played well enough to win – it was our defense that let us down” when the Vikings also had a really crap defense as well and Foles just didn’t play well enough to shred them.

          • Andy124

            I have never heard a Philadelphia fan praise Vick in a loss.
            Now you’re being disingenuous. Look no further than the San Diego game.

            Foles led the offense to 30 points. That is good enough to win.The numbers he put up against that lousy defense far exceed what that lousy defense gives up on the average. He does not play defense. It is silly to base an evaluation of a quarterback on how his defense played. If that’s all you have to say, I think we’re done here.

          • Bdawkbdawk

            Disengenuous is an awfully loaded term to use.
            What does “good enough to win” mean when you are losing?
            It is not silly to evaluate a QBs play by looking at the plays he made and the ones he missed and surmising if a league average QB would have made more plays or less plays. In fact, that’s what smart people do all the time. Hence Sheil’s comment about 600 yards.
            If you wish to hold your ears and close your eyes and “la lal la” away any Foles criticism, well, that’s your choice. I guess we are done here.

          • Andy124

            It is not silly to evaluate a QBs play by looking at the plays he made and the ones he missed and surmising if a league average QB would have made more plays or less plays.

            Which is pretty much the complete opposite of saying Cassell put up more points so Nick was bad.

          • Bdawkbdawk

            Youre right. Good thing I never said that.

            I first argued that Foles played average to poor on objective grounds. Missed passes, sacks, poor decisions. I then said that its interesting that Foles had a much more favorable matchup than Cassell, yet he underperformed him.
            You see there is a thing called nuance, and if you only read 1 of every 3 of my words, you won’t get it.

          • Andy124

            I don’t see the problem with expecting a presumably superior QB to outperform a lousy QB.

            when you get outplayed by Matt Cassell, you should take some heat.

          • Maggie

            Not once did Foles and Cassell play AGAINST each other.

          • Bdawkbdawk

            Very skillful rebuttal of an argument I didn’t make and haven’t implied.

          • pjcostello

            By saying one guy outplayed the other, you are implying such a thing — unless each takes the field against the same opponent, comparing them is foolhardy. One can critique either QB without directly comparing them to one another.

          • aub32

            Amen

          • Maggie

            Foles was not outplayed by Matt Cassell. The Eagles defense was outplayed by the Vikings offense. And perhaps there were some coaching decisions that were not perfect.

          • Bdawkbdawk

            But he was. Cassell made several more NFL throws (intermediate passes outside the hashmarks) and he didn’t take bad sacks. Even his interception was due to a flukey play instead of a late throw in a poor location.
            Foles made 2 excellent throws. But the rest were screens or drags. He left way too much on the table and it showed.

          • pjcostello

            I must have missed the part of the game where Foles took the field at the same time Cassel did…

      • Adam

        Who is unwilling to critique him? Nick didn’t play a great game, and that’s something everyone has agreed. But the problem is where people come out of the woodwork to say we lost because of him, or that this is why we need to draft a QB.

        Foles didn’t play a good game, and he still looked pretty good. 15th start, there’s going to be ups and downs. The problem lies with the people who are waiting to crucify him at the downs.

      • pjcostello

        If Foles isn’t evaluated using the same standards used to evaluate Vick, I postulate that one reason for the discrepancy is experience. Vick’s a ten-year veteran in the NFL, and Foles started less than a season’s worth of games. While they both had to learn a new offense, the ‘kid’ will always learn/assimilate new stuff more slowly than a vet who’s been through such changes multiple times in his career.

    • NJDIII

      Really??? Please be sarcasm or get chip off your profile pic. Funny, nothing was funny about the game on Sunday. The Cornerbacks/ safeties are to blame. If you score 30 points in nfl you should win every week Foles, although not spectacular, did enough to win. The defense was at fault. You must be high to think people watch the eagles because of Vick, it’s not 2004 or 2010 he is done all fans know this. You must not live in Philly, you can’t and be this ignorant. The question hasn’t been Vick vs. foles. It’s, is Foles a franchise qb? Does chip want a traditional drop back qb? So the question for fans has been Foles vs. College qbs. Even that died down after his 19-0 td interception ratio.

      • theycallmerob

        to be fair, you must have been high the past 6 months and skipped over all the summer, PS, and early RS threads that were almost exclusively Vick vs. Foles. This site in particular would routinely break 150-200 comments if one of their names was in the title.
        Thankfully, many of those in the former camp have moved on. Not that bad anymore

        • aub32

          They should have been. The two were in a QB competition. So why would the conversation be about Foles v. anyone else. However, Foles took the reigns after Vick got injured. He performed well, but people (myself included) wondered if the offense couldn’t be even better under somone more gifted. Gifted does not equal Vick. However, many people could let the Vick argument go and made every criticism about Foles a cry in favor of Vick. I made a post about JF v. Foles and somone came at me about wanting Vick. So NJDIII makes a solid point. It’s the people that hate Vick that make him an issue. I am a Vick fan, and not once since Foles beat Oakland did I say Vick should start.

          • theycallmerob

            I don’t argue that at all. I’d say there were just as many Vick haters as Vick fans trolling the boards. You were not the target of my intended post, nor was the QB competition; mainly the tone and tenor of those arguments in the past.
            More recently, the “is Foles the real deal?” and “Foles vs college guy” is brought about in 2 ways (not mutually exclusive):
            -the camp of fans who do think Foles has the ability to play for and thrive under Chip, based on his skills and ability to from the sample size so far
            -the camp of fans, and vick hanger-ons, who think that Kelly requires a mobile QB to truly run his designed offense and bring the team up to its highest level.
            Many of these critical geniuses helped frame the current argument, if only because Fole’s performances to some will never be as good as “Player X” (or Vick). Thus, it’s not so much comparing Foles to young Manning, or Brady, or Kaep or whoever- it’s what he is lacking physically, and the perceived ceiling of the offense.

          • NJDIII

            Eloquently said. I agree completely. If eagles miss playoffs then the mobile qb camp will surely flood this site. If Nicky “Montana” makes playoffs I think for the most part the qb position is set for next year.

          • theycallmerob

            I would hope so.
            I don’t discount what a mobile QB can do in a read-option offense. The problem with running QBs is always two-fold:
            1) Go ahead and rattle off all the star mobile QBs who could first and foremost beat you with their arm. It’s a short list- people always go to Young first, I’ve also heard Elway and Cunningham…but those are HOF level guys. For every Steve Young, there has been 100 Joe Webbs.
            Foles is actually, currently our QB. Has demonstrated positives very early that many look for in a franchise passer. What makes those folks certain that such a dominant mobile QB not only exists but is attainable?
            2) the true option attack will always suffer at the highest level. Defenses and their coordinators are simply too fast, strong, and smart to risk developing an attack with a rushing QB element. I get the whole sliding and running of bounds component, but should something happen to that QBs ability to run the offense will change fundamentally.
            At least now, Foles can “run” that offense- sure, it may be a 6 yard gain rather than 60, but he has the mental and physical abilities to deploy Kelly’s offense.
            For all the critical talk we bring about, I’d say 1/2 to 2/3 of the league would kill to have this problem.

          • aub32

            My argument would be that Kelly is the X factor. Kelly never had a pro level QB (before Mariota) and still had them killing it in Oregon. He turned Vick around. He has Foles playing at an insane level. I think it’s fair to say Foles has shown to be a better passer than Cam this season. However, what if they switched teams? Do you not think Kelly could have Cam playing at a much higher level than he currently is? How about someone so not once in a lifetime. Kaep was a second round pick. Do you not think Kelly could have him looking like how he did against GB more often than not?

          • theycallmerob

            even more so than Cam, I think a lot of Kaep is product of circumstance. Like RG3, he and that option hit the NFL by surprise. Plus one of the best OLs and defenses in the league, with another great coach, RB, TE, and WR? yes please. I absolutely bet Foles would have thrived there as well.
            6 of Foles starts (half) were in a different system, on a shit team. And he still has these numbers.
            Also, who is to say Kaep or Cam have the mental ability to play for Chip? That’s what sets Foles apart. I know it is easy to us to read about packaged plays, and going through reads to a receiver before finding the open guy. I don’t need to tell you how difficult that actually is. Yes, maybe Kaep opens up the run game- but is he throwing picks? Is he converting in the red zone?

          • aub32

            I don’t know why you would question their mental ability. Kaep was killing the passing game until he lost his weapons. I know we say the Eagles are flawed, but I would take DJax and McCoy over most #1 WR-RB combos. Kaep lost Crabtree, and that really hurt. Cam has only had Steve Smith, an old Steve Smith. Plus it’s about route combinations. Greg Cossell said in an interview that the biggest reason Foles is able to see the field so well is that Chip’s route combinations give him so much space. Lastlt, we are of differencing opinion about last year. Foles was not a starting QB last year. He threw a number of high volume passes and put up decent stats. Reid has been able to do this with plenty of guys. Look at Smith’s stats from last week. The guy threw 4 TDs. They traveled a combined total of 13 yards in the air.

          • theycallmerob

            I only question what I don’t know- SF’s passing game is not the same as ours.
            And I only brought up last year due to the use of Fole’s stats in his overall (14) games started, as compared to others. If you extrapolate just this year, it’s hard to imagine a QB- mobile or not- that would do better under Kelly.

          • Adam

            One thing I know for sure is I trust Chip. If it turns out he sees a kid in the draft that fits his mold, then I will have thoroughly enjoyed the Nick Foles experience. I just highly doubt Chip will find a guy who he can be sure will step in and produce better than Foles in the NFL. Starting QB just isn’t a position you gamble on especially when you already have a safe bet.

            Maybe he goes the Harbaugh route and brings in his own guy and waits for Foles to falter. I don’t see it, but who knows. If it works, then you can dangle Foles out as trade bait. If it doesn’t, you can dangle the other guy out.

            The scenario I see most likely is Chip realizes he has a gifted NFL QB right in his lap and he tailors his system around him, like he has been doing all year.

            GJ “The Franchise” Kinne

          • Andy124

            Look at it like this. He didn’t spend a high draft pick on a quarterback this year when he had Vick coming off another terrible year and Nick was pretty much an unknown. Now he’s got Nick as the leading passer in the league and there’s a question that he might spend a high draft pick, when his QB situation is so much better than it was going in to the last draft?

            I don’t think it’s very realistic.

          • aub32

            I think Foles was overtaken by McCown

          • Andy124

            Foles = 117.0
            Manning = 112.9
            McCown = 109.8

          • aub32

            The ATL podcast lied to me. I am definitely not voting for them in the stitcher awards.

          • aub32

            I know you weren’t aiming at me. I just thought the topic was worth joining. I think it’s hard to knock the athletic QB (I detest calling them mobile as it is often given as an insult) camp for wanting to see what Chip can do with a guy like that. Just look at what our run game was like when Vick was in. Had Vick or player X stayed healthy, this team could have broken every rushing record there is. Even now, fans see the opportunity for the QB to get yards on the ground. Think of what player X could have done with the space Foles had. I get the trade off is durability and passing ability, which is why Vick can’t do it. He just can’t stay healthy. However, I’d argue Luck or Cam would be unstoppable in this offense. Cam is not as developed a passer as Foles, but he a Shady wold break records, win games, and keep the D off of the field. There’s no way we don’t get every single 3rd/1-4th/1 with Cam.

          • theycallmerob

            I went more in-depth a post below, but I agree with the mobile aspect. Again, the issue is where is this guy?.
            Luck is (or may be, I guess) that once-in-a-generation passer, the next surefire HOF. How often does that happen?
            and at least personally, I’d say the jury is still out on Cam. I don’t think his passing game is evolved yet to really beat up on those defenses in the playoffs. And just as you say Foles is helped out by the skill guys around him, I’d say Cam benefitted heavy from an excellent defense, great #1 WR, good OL and decent run game behind him.

          • Andy124

            Mobility is great if the passing ability is there. If Player A is a demonstrably better passer than Player B, Player B’s mobility is not as valuable as Player A’s superior passing ability, even if Player B’s mobility advantage is greater than Player A’s passing advantage.

            If Player A and Player B are close in passing ability, the added mobility of Player B adds value in any offensive system.

            I don’t think the odds of any college quarterbacks being as good a passer as Nick Foles is (now or in the future) are very good. Certainly not good enough to spend a resource as valuable as a high draft pick on one.

          • theycallmerob

            All of that is true. But with Chip, it’s not just passer ability.
            We take for granted all the things said about Foles taking Chip’s offense from chalkboard to field. Yes, Chip has had similar success with “lesser” QBs in college. But there, his game was always run-centric.
            I just find it hard to make the claim that “look what Foles has done; now, imagine a comparable passer (the two brought up on this thread are Kaep and Cam) and assume they would thrive under Kelly due to athleticism”. At the end of the day, the premium is still on decision-making. And nothing they’ve done currently on their respective teams or in college asks of them the same things Kelly asks of his QB.
            As good as Vick’s #s were at the beginning of the year- and, yes, the run game- you could still see where part of the old Vick crept to the surface. Still had trouble with coverages and making good-decision passes.

          • Tom w

            Russ wilson

          • theycallmerob

            and?
            he plays on the best team in football. I’m sure many QBs would have success on that team. Again, not sure what he has to do with the success of Foles in this offense. Or why you think he’d be any better; Wilson’s stats are not otherworldly.

          • Andy124

            I was agreeing with you. Decision making is a critical part of passing ability.

          • aub32

            I’d argue We have better weapons and rushing talent. I am sure the Panthers would trade their entire backfield and TEs for Shady. I also think DJax is a better #1 than Steve Smith at this point.

        • NJDIII

          Seriously coming at me with this (I respect and read 99% of your comments). In football talk the summer might as well be 1955 meaningless. Any Vick fan, no matter how stubborn was silenced after giants game. Hence the argument was silenced. It became foles vs college. The defense was written about differently this week, then the previous 5, because Sunday just happened. Vick is irrelevant and so is that argument, could of been nicer in my critique.

          • theycallmerob

            I as well, I think I did a better job explaining in my post below.

      • Adam

        That’s a completely different argument and a great one that we would welcome. Problem is is that’s rarely ever the discussion.

    • Scott J

      Ignore the Vick fanboys. They’ll jump on the RG3 bandwagon next year.

  • Fly High

    I really liked Tim’s perspective on question 2. Real balance, not a swing that the sky has fallen after a loss, but not pollyanna either.

  • Kev_H

    Tim loves the coach. Right now one can make the case that Kelly’s a strong coordinator but a so-so head coach. The Eagles are 8-6 despite sketchy game management. They might have 2 more wins with stronger head coaching. So when can we expect to see that change?

    • OregonDucker

      In about 10 to 12 years after 3 SB wins.

    • jabostick

      A coordinator doesn’t set the “program” for the entire franchise though. That’s really what has sold me on Chip. There’s more to coaching than just coaching, if that makes sense

    • aub32

      I think you have to factor in how he has managed the team off of the field. His ability to deal with the Vick/Foles transition, the Riley Cooper thing, and getting all the players to buy into their new roles is much more of what I would expect of a HC than a OC.

    • Tom w

      I entirely disagree. He is a once in a generation offensive mind and program builder. Just stop with the Monday morning qbacking. This team was abysmal last year and before and he turned ith around in less than 6 games. So so coach my ass. Atleast 22 nfl teams would sell their soul for chip.

  • cloisterwater

    Throw in a fourth quarter interception, and Foles did his best Tony Romo impression. Put up great fantasy numbers while losing the game.

    • D-von

      I know right. I mean look at how foles let cassel pass all over him. Foles played some poor defense this week. Eagles need to replace him immediately. Oh wait…

    • nicksaenz1

      Romo has his fault in Sunday’s loss, but that D is just awful. When you score 30 (in the Eagles’ case) or 36 (Dallas’) you should win the game.

      • GEAGLE

        If romo didnt want the blame, he could have ran the play his OC called and handed it off and NOBODY would say a word about him…when the idiot choses a pass option in crunch time and throws his 100th late game INT, he needs to feel the heat….if you wanna be slick like FOles to Celek when he slid! then YOU BETTER know what you are doing and you better deliver

        • nicksaenz1

          Look no argument. But what causes you to lose when you’re up 29-3? Or was it 29-6 when the comeback started? We can split hairs here, but if you can’t hold a 23 or 26 point lead, at least SOME of the blame has to be attributed to piss poor D.

          • jabostick

            Agreed. It’s the track record at this point, though. He’s going to have trouble shaking that rep until they make a deep playoff run

          • nicksaenz1

            No arguing the track record, either. Hell, I called him Romo Claus on here yesterday, because he’s one of our best players in December. But you don’t have be a football genius to know that you gotta hold a 20+ point lead.

          • GEAGLE

            In reality, if you lose with 30 points on the board, I ALWAYS blame the defense or ST…if a QB puts up 30, he should win that game….BUT I can’t help myself when it comes to Tony :)

          • GEAGLE

            Absolutely!!! That defense should get as much blame as romo gets…I guess it’s Romos history. Since 2006 he has two times as many crunch time INTs as any other QB..when you have that rep hanging by your neck, you HAVE to break it. You CANT just continue to fuel that fire…..look at Peyton, he got sick of hearing the talk about how he can’t play in the cold, so he went out and lit a BONFIRE in the cold lol……I can understand what romo did, if the entire world wasn’t sitting at their TV expecting him to throw an INT….and good OL Tony, certainly doesn’t disappoint lol. I love that Guy!!!!

            I don’t even know how to rank my ever dying love for Romo,Jerry,garret!Snyder,Eli, shannahan….

        • Mitchell

          Like I’ve said before, Romo is a butterface.

    • jabostick

      There’s a difference between having big stats in a blowout loss (where you throw 50 times) and snatching defeat from the jaws of victory

    • Adam

      Yes because Foles had a commanding lead the entire game and threw it away. Definitely wasn’t the defense allowing 48 points. Nope.

      • cloisterwater

        Jeez, people sure are chippy in here. Contrary to popular belief, Romo doesn’t throw games away every week. He usually has very good numbers, but winds up losing. Not sure if you’ve witnessed the historically bad defense in Dallas.

        • Adam

          Not every week, just December :)

          Tony is the lightning rod. But it’s clearly a combination of play calling, his play, and the terrible defense. But let’s not pretend those last two picks last week weren’t bad decisions on his behalf. His D and coach put him in that spot, he just pulls the trigger.

          • cloisterwater

            If I came off as a Romo-supporter I deeply apologize. I enjoy ripping him as much as anybody, it was simply a joke. In fact, I thought I was ripping him when I posted that.

        • Tom w

          Romo historically plays horrible in October and December and wins less than half his games …. And one playoff game. He sucks and everyone knows it. 3- 4 big games a year then garbage … And he gets the cake turkey game every year. Comparing a 10 yr veteran fraud and foles at start 15 is moronic

    • aub32

      I should have warned you that any hint of knocking Foles will be met with extreme prejudice.

      • OregonDucker

        Ain’t that the truth. But it took a whole team to lose this one.

    • Tom w

      Dope

  • Justin

    The first question I brought up elsewhere. Foles 30-of-48, 428 yards, 3 TDs and a pick. And people call that an off game for him? If that’s his version of an off game, we have ourselves a franchise QB who will build a dynasty for us.

    • GEAGLE

      Yes sir….I mean take Dallas out of the equation, what’s his worst games?
      1) Vikings
      2) I don’t even know what two is, since I can’t hold a blizzard against a QB
      3) Tampa where he ONLY threw two TDs I guess?

      Besides Dallas, ALL of Nicks “worst” games this year, he has performed better then about 90% of the great QBs performed at that time in NTHEIR career…..FOles first 16 games make Peyton mannings first 16 games look like Matt leinert…
      ….
      People really don’t get that he shouldn’t be doing what he is doing so soon in his NFL experience, and so soon in a drastically new offense
      ..
      I don’t think people get how SERIOUS it is for a kid to throw over 60%, in his first year in two completely different offenses! without having NFL experience..That screams CHANCE TO BE GREAT! He throwing 60% this year with a great Oline learning this offense 8 months ago…last year he was a rookie placed in the worst position possible behind the worst line you could put together and he throws 60% the first year in Andy’s offense…what in the world is he going to look like once he gets a second year in an offense? His decision making is off the charts for his age and for his experience level or lack their of…..if he had a different personality, he could regress….but from what I think I nk now about his humble, fearless, accountable, hardworking Charecter…if that’s who he really is, he will be a GREAT NFL QB

      Two years from now, we will consistently have one of the best QBs in the NFL…I have little doubt

      • nicksaenz1

        Which Tampa game?

        • GEAGLE

          I was trying to rank his worst games this year…he was awesome in Tampa, but he is almost always awesome…
          ..
          What are his worst performances this year? I honestly can’t even tell you because he consistently plays well

          • nicksaenz1

            Well it was 3 TDs in Tampa plus a rushing TD… Leaving out the Snow Bowl, I’d say GB and Minn. I include GB because we caught some fortunate bounces.

          • GEAGLE

            Forgot the GB game, yeah that would prob be worst then his modest Tampa ass kicking…..either way, his worst gives me a ton of confidence

          • nicksaenz1

            TB wasn’t even a bad game. He shredded a zone while flawlessly executing the O.

          • GEAGLE

            Lol I KNOW…I only think he had a BAD game against Dallas….every other game is more then an acceptable performance from a kid with less then a seasons experience. Running an offense he learned 8 months ago which is an offense that requires so much decision making….romo been in the same offense he been running for years, and he doesn’t have y handle the high volume of packaged plays that Nick has to consistently chose from…..we are leaning on an inexperienced kid to make so many more decisions then QBs of his age are asked to do, and he happens to be so damn freakishly good at it

          • anon

            Arizona?

      • Michael Jorden

        A lot of it is on Nick’s perceived ceiling. Some people just don’t believe he has much room to improve. I don’t get that at all – I would expect from what I’ve seen Nick will continue to improve on things for years to come.. which would leave him looking pretty fantastic down the road. The potential is on display right now.

  • jabostick

    Boy, that comment section escalated quickly. It really got out of hand fast. Did Geagle throw a trident?

    • aub32

      LMAO. Nice Anchorman reference

    • nicksaenz1

      Even the guy who can’t think said something!

  • Tom w

    The kid had 15 starts. And he is playing great. And our media needs to write critical articles and say outlandish things to sell papers, hits, and ratings on the radio and Comcast. Our sheepish angry shortsighted fan based criticizes at a drop of the hat … Not just foles who is basically a rookie. Id rather live in Baghdad then play pro sports in this town. I sweat half the fans enjoy when things go wrong because they have something to bitch about and deflect the inadeqacies in their own lives. Oh and les Bowen is a moron for saying we now expect perfection. No, only dopes do.

    • jabostick

      It’s weird that he (and Vick, really, which might be the underlying factor) are so polarizing. Why can’t there be any middle ground? I thought Tim said it pretty well. Good game; promising given his experience; but also left plays on the field and made mistakes.

      All are reasonable things to expect from any QB. The choice isn’t “burn him at the stake” or “annoint him a demigod”. How about he is a good, potentially excellent piece, that we need to surround with weapons, a solid line, and a complementary D

      • Tom w

        Polarizing … It’s the kids 15th start. We have nothing else to criticize a good game where he has 1 int and a 110 qb rating and. 400 yds passing. Be happy we probably have our franchise qb. It’s his 15 th start for god sake. You wanna criticize the Dallas game go ahead. But to poke and prod this week .. And it’s obviously a ploy by Bowen to get people to read. Qb criticism sells because the Average nitwit can atleast see every throw. Same reason the dopes criticize the rushes by shady without taking into account the read OPTIoN, foles keepers, foles keepers to throw, and the goddamn 8 man fronts we faced and the 400 yds of passing we put up. The nitwits don’t understand profootballfocus so they criticize what sitting on their face … The qb and rushing attempts…. Someone shoot me

        • EaglePete

          its also the NFL, the most popular sport that runs this land right now and the age of instant gratification and ridicule per the internet. Some of the hyperbole is just that, and even after nit picking everything if you had a reasoned conversation face to face with someone to look back at a season it wouldnt be so over the top. So take solace in that at least, everything does not appear to be what it really is in writing for most of the writers and posters. Dont for a second think Philly is alone in this. That part bothers me more than anything, its the nature of NFL fans esp with the parity and ability to rebuild so fast expectations are through the roof. Reminds me of every bad fan being in Philly broad brush BS only to read all the awful fan news recently in Denver, SF etc. Stupid people are everywhere

        • anon

          If you watched the first half and thought we were playing well you gotta get your eyes checked. But even when you have a decent game you gotta analyze the things you get wrong instead of patting yourself on the back for the thing you did right. You’ll never improve any other way. Yes he ended up with good stats on the game, but we’d e in much better position if we could have done more in the first half.

          Plus to be fair look at the competition. He put up those stats against a defense who is the second worst in the league when they have their starters and they were down 3 starters (not to mention AP). If we can’t put up big numbers on that team then something’s wrong. It’s not like he put up 400 on Seattle — but no one is saying he’s a bad qb.

      • Nicholas Disilvestro

        I’m not sure Foles is a really polarizing figure. Most of the people that don’t like him are either die hard Vick fans or like a poster above me said, just think that Kelly needs a mobile qb to run his offense. (Regardless of what his stats look like)

  • Brent E. Sulecki

    Nicks 14 starts.
    7-7 record
    61.4% passing
    4,097 yards passing
    29 pass TDs
    7 INTs
    251 yards rushing
    4 rush TDs
    this kid is def. getting criticized far too much. let him grow would ya.
    sunday wasn’t on him. IMO that game was on CK and his gameplan.
    he didn’t have the greatest of games sunday. but he fought thru his inaccuracies at times and brought the team to within 5 pts with a minute left in the 3rd quarter.
    with some ridiculous throws to djack and ertz.
    if not great so far than I don’t know what the word means.
    look up past qbs first 14 starts. with a few exceptions he crushes most of them.

    • nicksaenz1

      Pretty sure he crushes them all in first 14 starts. Wasn’t Scam the first rookie to break 4k yards?

      • Brent E. Sulecki

        im not sure. but I guess it was peyton then scam broke peytons. yeah I think you are right. Nick hasn’t even been thru 16 yet. hes still very much learning.

      • Andy124

        Oddly enough, I just ran Mr. Cam Newton’s numbers for his first 14 starts. He was good, but no Nick Foles. Key stat, 16 interceptions.

        • theycallmerob

          He was good, but no Nick Foles

          That’s my new life standard.
          “What’s that, son? you finished all your homework and chores? Good job, but you’re still no Nick Foles.”

          “Obama just brought about mid-east peace? He’s good, but no Nick Foles. Nick would have done it before his 6th start.”

          “Wilt slept with 20,000 women? wow…pretty good. but he’s no Nick Foles”

          • Andy124

            Llol.

          • nicksaenz1

            Nick Foles slept with 20,000 in his first season.

          • Andy124

            You just had a street named after you? Good job son. But Nick Foles had the league named after him during his second season. They’re all playing in the Nick Foles League now.

          • nicksaenz1

            Awesome. Just awesome.

          • Adam

            The Nick Goldes Standard

        • anon

          17 rushing tds 708 rushing yds and they weren’t running RO is pretty impressive. Foles is a great QB, i think it’s a combo of him and the scheme.

          • Andy124

            It is pretty impressive. I’m a fan of Newton.

    • Tom w

      Defense. Chip? Really . Gameplan? Jesus Christ.

    • Token

      Its simple……

      If you were drafting a QB in the 1st round and someone told you thats what his first 14 starts numbers would look like, you would say “yes please”.

  • cloisterwater

    People really thought I was ripping Foles with that comment?
    I may need to change my shtick when joking around with this crowd. Or at least wait until after a win to joke.

    • jabostick

      Ha. Things *are* testy after a loss in here

      • Tom w

        Nah just sick of dopes who bitch about everything without really understanding anything and are jjust overly critical bc they think it’s what Philly eagles fandom is about. Basically sounding like my 9 yr old nephew after the eagles loss and listening to Angelo for 35 minutes or the dope rendell after the game. The team has weaknesses and the defense played poorly but like chip said every game is different and move on to the next. I truly believe if ap and Xavier Rhodes play last week we win bc they run run run and play more man. We didn’t have that offensive gameplan on tape, Cassell played his career best game, and the vikes played zone a ton . Weird game all in all.

        • cloisterwater

          Good luck with that.

  • Kev_H

    I love watching games and generally enjoy reading what they have to offer here, but I find some of the “analysis” almost offensive and being little more than the gussied up knee jerk reactions of a fan. “Analysis” by writers with little in terms of formal football credentials brings out “truths”? You have to be kidding me. In the game of football, fans are reactionary and the game commentators are equally reactionary, but wearing suits and speaking more eloquently, and then these writers extend the reactionary mojo but try to add more gravitas as “analysts”. On Monday morning when you look at a few sacks, you can say the QB held the ball too long. Or, if it turned out he held the ball just as long, avoided the sack, and hit a game changing pass, he would be lauded by analysts for “keeping the play alive,” showing patience, and being too competitive to give up..
    We’ve heard it all before. QB threads the needle between 3 defenders he is lauded for his arm, confidence, and competitiveness. The same throw gets tipped and intercepted, Tim McManus will tell us that the throw was foolish and should have never been attempted. What makes the sport fun is that it is played on a knife edge and it’s a fine line between waiting too long resulting in a sack and waiting too long extending a play. I’ll grant you, if a QB takes a sack that takes the team out of field goal range or causes the clock to run out, there is a clear truth that he held the ball too long. Any other “truth revealing analysis” is really just outcome based reactionary Monday morning quarterbacking.

    • jabostick

      I understand what you are saying, and I certainly feel it with a lot of tv/studio analysts, but I don’t get that with this site. The reason I come here (and from moving the chains before it) is I don’t find the analysis lazy and repetitive. I also don’t think Tim or Sheil speak/write as if they’re gatekeepers to football truth. I find them objective and level-headed. I find I do get insight out of it too.

    • theycallmerob

      Kev, he said Foles held it too long “on a few occasions”. I don’t think that’s exactly over-reactionary analysis. I mean, I’d say it’s just pretty accurate. Not sure why that line deserved such critique.

      • Kev_H

        Because it’s only too long after the fact. If getting sacked is the criteria for too long, who needs in-depth analysis to reveal that truth?

        • theycallmerob

          Dude, it’s a football blog. Tim and Sheil are writing articles, not a Declaration of All Things Self-Evident Re: Nick Foles. I missed the part where Tim says “everything I write is as it was, as it is, and as it always will be”

          why are you so worked up about this game? As Tim said, all QBs (especially the great ones) are over-scrutinized. Maybe you missed this line:

          If you were looking for greatness on Mall Of America Field Sunday, you didn’t find it. If you were looking for pretty good overall play out of a promising young quarterback, you walked away generally pleased. As in many things, it’s about perspective.

          would you say that’s an unfair assessment too?

          • Andy124

            If you were looking for pretty good overall play out of a promising young quarterback, you walked away generally pleased.

          • theycallmerob

            no, stop! what does he mean by “generally”?!?

            I’m pretty sure T-Mac is illuminati

          • rob

            you got that from tommy lawlor you plagerisin mother !@#$ :)

          • theycallmerob

            What are you talking about, that quote is from this very article. Read much ahole?

        • anon

          i think it’s a fair criticism, though i don’t know if they are always guilty of it.

    • Tom w

      Thank you. And that knee jerk reaction is this town sports media and fanbase Ina nutshell. This site typically excluded and lawlors

    • GEAGLE

      Trust me, I HEAR you…but in that regard TM and SK are about as responsible as you can find with the pathetic coverage we get in this city..
      ..
      If I could get them to improve on something, it wouldn’t be the analysis..I would want them to improve the quality of questions that they ask coaches/players…and I hope I’m not coming off as ripping anyone,because that’s not my intention….but consistently I hear THE WRONG QUESTIONS being asked…and they usually start with “sorry but I have to ask this…” NO YOU DONT!! If you have to appologize about what you are asking huge you should know that you probably aren’t going to get an awesome response, it’s most likely something they don’t want to talk about or open up to…

      If you see that it’s OBVIOUS our coach has a gag order on players not allowing them to talk about how great they are, or give up sports science secrets, why waste what few questions you get to ask, on questions you should KNOW you won’t get a good answer for….ask players questions they CAN and will be happy answer….it’s better then wasting a question on something you will get a crappy answer for, just so you can say I had to ask it….no you don’t have to ask it, you hve to provide INTEL to their fans…asking a question you aren’t going to get Intel from is not being a conduit to this fan

  • Gzerms25

    “You playing for the Cowboys. Boy you better get used to losing.”

    • GEAGLE

      Kurt Cousin will throw for 400 yards against them this week…I can just feel their secondary shredding!!

      • OregonDucker

        Yes, I think he will. Cowgirls will lose because they got a knife in the heart by GB.

        • cliff henny

          think so too. their defense turns every qb into peyton manning and an elite offense. ‘skins defense isnt terrible. romo has to play flawless and even that might not be enough

          • nicksaenz1

            Flawless by what standard? The actual definition or flawless for Romo, which means the pick comes in the first half, not the second?

  • GEAGLE

    If the Giants GM answered his phone and heard, hey I’ll trade you FOles straight up for Eli…what do you think he would say?

    How about if outhouse offer FOles for RG3?
    ..
    What about if you offer FOles to jerry for Romo?

    • Andy124

      Jerry would definitely say no. Dude LOVES Tony. And yes, in that way. Not that there’s anything wrong with that.

  • Scott J

    I was watching Stafford miss open receivers Monday Night, and he throws to Calvin Johnson. Foles shows a lot of promise. He’ll have up and down games. I don’t think we lost to Minnesota because of Nick. We lost because of our defense, especially our secondary. That is still the weakest link on our team and I hope it will be addressed in FA and the draft.