Wake-Up Call: No Winners From Foles Letdown

Eagles QB Mike Vick and Nick FolesThe joint press conference last week prior to the Dallas game carried some symbolism with it.

As the quarterbacks were walking off the practice field and towards the podium, they wore a look as if to ask, “Who’s first?” The Eagles’ PR rep solved the problem by waving both of them up.

Nick Foles was coming off the best game of his professional career and looked comfortable as he shared the moment with the vet. Michael Vick heaped praise on the young quarterback and said he would be ready if and when he was called upon again.


Some wondered if this was the passing of the torch. It at least felt like Foles had pulled even with Vick for a lap of the race, and who knows, maybe he can nudge in front with a quality outing against the Cowboys?

Instead, he crashed. And as he did, some Foles detractors/Vick supporters pointed at the wreckage and delivered told-you-sos to those that hitched their wagon to the second-year signal-caller. After a hot debate that raged for a couple weeks in Philadelphia, there was a moment of vindication for those who backed Vick.

But make no mistake: there were no winners as a result of Sunday's performance. The search for a franchise QB is back at Square One.

While the odds were against it, there was at least a little hope that Foles was the guy. The Eagles kept him off the market this offseason because they had seen enough to be intrigued and were not prepared to rule him out as a potential solution. Then came a couple flashes against the Giants and Bucs. Good enough to want to see more still.

We all know what happened next. Foles stalled in the biggest moment of his career. It was only one game and a quarterback should certainly not be judged off one game alone, but the NFL is a harsh business. Quarterbacks only get so many chances to prove their case. That applies particularly to QBs without a first-round pedigree.

The Vick-Foles debate has flamed out, and Vick has re-assumed his place out in front. He is the best option for this team right now. That remains true. It's also true that Vick is 33 and injury-prone. As much as he helps this team when healthy, he can't be relied on week to week let alone down the line.

The Eagles are open to landing a franchise quarterback no matter the form. Even if Foles isn't the Chip Kelly prototype, they'd make it work in order to solidify the most important position in football. Maybe Foles is being graded too harshly off one performance. Maybe he still is the guy. But the chances of that being true took a pretty substantial hit. Those odds dipped, right along with his trade value.

A home run against the Cowboys would have been a real solid statement from Foles but something much less pretty unfolded. As a result the state of the quarterback position was weakened, and there's no one with a vested interest in the Eagles that benefits from that.

WHAT YOU MISSED

Sheil uses the All-22 to analyze the state of the Eagles' defense.

An inside look at how Trent Cole has reinvented his game.

Billy Davis is growing into his role as Eagles' defensive coordinator.

WHAT THEY'RE SAYING

The trade deadline is fast approaching. Joe Banner sees more wheeling and dealing ahead in the modern-day NFL. From ESPN:

Before the NFL's 2012 season, the league and the players union agreed to extend the trading deadline two weeks -- this year's cutoff is Oct. 29 at 4 p.m. ET -- giving teams more time to make deals without compromising the integrity of competition.

Banner, who was the Eagles' president from 2001-12, sees the NFL loosening up and trading more often. "It comes down to a comfort level," he said. "Five picks from Atlanta for Julio Jones? I believe this will seem less bold in a year or so. I know certain teams would be reluctant to look at deals like this, but I think you'll see more trades in the future. "Not an avalanche, but more."

David Steele of the Sporting News wrote a column titled, "Reality setting in: Chip Kelly's offense a nightmare for Eagles." Unlike the Grantland piece, we're fairly certain this one isn't satire.

Kelly’s job now is to filter out both dreams and nightmares and discover the reality of his offense. It’s closer to what happened against the Cowboys Sunday than to the season opener in Washington.

It’s not because NFL defenses have caught on to him, either—although it is now clear that the Redskins’ defense gives up tons of yards (ninth-worst in the NFL going into Monday) and points (fourth-worst) to every team.

There simply is little for the league to catch up to right now. The fast-paced offense has slowed tremendously, they rarely put defenses on their heels as they were earlier, and they are ineffective and inconsistent.

COMING UP

We'll roll out our predictions for Eagles-Giants.

  • 1972

    Hey Tim I heard a couple of fans getting on you last night, but here’s the thing. There’s no winners in either Quarterback letdown. But when vick gets hurt or has a bad game the foles supporters do they same thing as the vick supporters.
    I know you like foles, but I don’t. His arm strength in cold weather is still an issue, and now his heart is in question as well.
    And P.S Foles detractors don’t have to be vick supporters. I don’t like either qb.

    • mrparabolic

      It’s like you didn’t even read the article.

      • 1972

        Please elaborate. This article was most likely written because of the flack Tim was getting for liking Foles. In my opinion, along with most rational football fans Vick is the better player. But some (not all) want Foles to play at the detriment of the team. And I don’t agree with that.
        A lot of it is hate,a lot of it is vicks history of not winning, but you can clearly see that vicks the better player.
        So if I don’t think Foles will win us a superbowl, my choice is the best player available. not VICK LOVE!!!!

        • Justin

          Other could argue that NOT playing Foles is detrimental to the team long term. Vick isn’t a long term answer, and we have no idea still what we have in Foles. You let your love for Vick trump your love for the Eagles.

          • 1972

            I don’t love any qb on these team. You may have no idea, not we have no idea of what Foles is. I don’t like him as a starting qb. its that simple. This is all opinion, but the facts are what they are… Vick is the better of the 2 qb is he not? can u at least admit that? If not, then I know where your allegiance lies

          • Justin

            I’m a fan of Michael Vick. I bought his jersey during the 2011 season when things were going downhill. But I’m first and foremost an Eagles fan. Even if Foles isn’t “the guy” for us, for all we know he could show flashes that some other team would give up draft pick(s) for. And unlike others, I’m not so delusional that I think we’ll win the Super Bowl this year simply because we’re one game back in the division.

  • Southern Oregon Eagle

    Its like these national folks didn’t even watch the game before burying Chip’s offense. As has been mentioned multiple times on this website, even a poor showing by Foles probably puts up 3 touchdowns on the Cowgirls… The offense is working just fine, execution was the worst yet.

    • jabostick

      Yes.

      Sweet Christ, why can’t the national look at anything other than the 1st half of the Washington game. That’s the only thing that’s ever brought up. There’s a small mountain of evidence from the other games that suggests the offense is good. Potentially really good.

      It isn’t infallible and it isn’t immune to a top flight defense or a piss poor QB/O-line/WR execution but it’s good now, and potentially outstanding.

    • southy

      Not to mention 1st half of the season with a new coaching staff with essentially the same offensive personnel as 2 previous failed seasons and coaches who are continually cautioning that the transition is going to take some time. Sometimes the best way to deal with idiocy this idiotic is to ignore it, even if it is TMac’s job to quote it.

  • GEAGLE

    Trash

    • cliff henny

      steele article?

  • GiveMeABreak

    The QB “controversy” is evidently irresistible but is really not what we need to focus on. With McCoy, Brown and Polk/Tucker, we have 3 really good backs. I expected us to have a bad defense but for the life of me can’t figure out what has happened to the 0-line. If we can’t consistently run the ball, we are in trouble. Shady can try to take the blame for it, but the line needs to open holes for him. If we solve that piece, then the QB is less critical.

    • Will

      Defenses loading the box against the run and forcing the Eagles to beat them with the pass.

    • Adam

      The lack of success in the run game against Dallas was because there was zero pass game. Dallas sold out to stop the run and left receivers open, Foles just didn’t capitalize on that. If you get the passing going, especially screen stuff, all in turn opens up some running lanes. Some of it was on the line Sunday but some of it was McCoy trying to do too much and not following his blocks. But that’s fine, he absolutely gets a pass because he’s hands down our best and most consistent player.

      • Scott J

        It also would help if we had receivers who can get off of man press.

        • Will

          The all 22 showed wide open uncovered receiver’s that Foles did not throw too. I don’t know why but Foles made some bad decision where to pass to thru out the game. Most were deep passes to the outside yet Foles forced into the middle of the field instead.

    • Wilbert31

      If Foles had hit the open receivers, the running game would have worked better. The whole offensive scheme suffered because of Foles.

      • Will

        yup they were open for sure…a cleaner pocket would of helped…

  • Richard Colton

    Can I up vote the entire column? Especially this line: “The search for a franchise QB is back at Square One”

    • Will

      Rookie Qb’s gonna have growing pains….Foles or whoever you draft for the franchise next year if you go that route, with parts of 9 games played I still consider Foles a rookie QB.

      • Richard Colton

        What rookie? Barkley? He’s your long term answer at QB? come on.

        • Will

          I still think Barkley has no chance in the NFL….

          • Richard Colton

            ok. you edited your first comment. Foles isn’t a rookie, even if you want him to be. The questions that we had about Foles weren’t answered in either the Tampa Bay or Dallas game. He hasn’t shown the ability to zip balls into tight windows. He holds the ball too long and is indecisive. Has he done anything yet in two years to suggest he can be a franchise QB.

            Plenty of rookies play their first year Will, its the new NFL paradigm.

          • Will

            True and others get groomed …Foles I think can be a great QB if given time. It is a long season if Vick goes down I want Foles not Barkley.

          • Richard Colton

            Foles can be a great QB? Based on what, hope? That isn’t really a solid plan for a franchise. The first 6 weeks of the season have confirmed ONLY two things for me:

            #1 Chip Kelly can coach in the NFL
            #2 The franchise QB is not on the Eagles roster

          • Will

            We agree to disagree, I wonder how Brady faired his first year.

          • 1972

            Threw 3 passes. But won to the superbowl his second year

          • Will

            Brady had a great supporting cast around him.

          • 1972

            You comparing these two qb’s? please don’t do that

          • Will

            No just think I personally want to see Foles start in a few more games against top talent Defenses before I say ok we need a QB when Vick is gone. Foles may or may not be the guy. Too early to tell at this point. The Dallas game was disappointing to say the least. Now if Nicky gets 2 or 3 more starts and lays eggs all around then hey we might need a QB of the future.

          • #7

            It would be a disaster Will. Dallas has an average D and Folds wilted like a leaf

          • Richard Colton

            OK. So hope really IS your answer. In that case, I’m with you. I HOPE the Eagles draft the next Tom Brady in the 6th round next year. See? we agree.

          • Will

            LMAO…

          • southy

            If you have a shot at a 1st round guy that you think can run your offense, take him. If there’s a guy in the 2nd/3rd that you think has potential, pull the trigger. Brady was 6th r, Brees was 2nd round, Wilson was 3rd, Rodgers was 24th overall, Kaep was 2nd round…. just have to take your shots where you can get em and hope you hit.

            I’d rather not pull a Shanny and try to combine suckitude with mortgaging the rest of the team to get a can’t miss guy, only to realize that the QB can’t play defense for you.

          • Richard Colton

            OK. If someone offered you Luck for Danny Watkins, Graham, and Cox – would you take it? I think we overvalue picks when we become slavishly devoted to Jerry’s chart.

          • Will

            yes no brainier….Cox would hurt but would pull the trigger first would offer Trent Cole over Cox or Vinny Curry…..did you see Luck against Denver?

          • anon

            We need more (better) WRs, OLBs, Safeties, DBs, TEs. I feel like this year has just exposed that we still under-perform in several aspects of the game.

          • #7

            Will, I’m not sure how you’re coming up with this. What are you basing Foles’ potential “greatness” on? I’ve watched every game and I’m sure you have too.

            The only thing great about Foles is that he’s tall and moves well within the pocket…well he did last year as a rookie. Can’t name anything else.

          • Will

            Tall, moves well in the pocket, was making quick decisions and getting the ball out. Foles needs work on the Deep pass to the sidelines. Foles very uncomfortable throwing that one type of pass. Dallas played the run and basically took away the middle of the field passing game. Now if Foles can work on that part of his game I think he would be an okay QB, if not Foles won’t be around.

          • #7

            He’s 6’6. He should be able to hit those throws with ease. Nice pocket movement. How in the hell can he not make those throws and be in the NFL? Seems like Barkley was hitting those throws you mentioned when he came in

          • Will

            Notice it very early last season. Foles has very little confidence in making that throw deep to the outside. Foles prefers to work underneath, anywhere in the middle of the feild and go long down the middle or seam routes.

          • #7

            That plays into the defense’s hands. Throws to the sideline are staple throws that NFL QBs HAVE to make. Period.

          • Will

            Granted either Foles overcomes that or he is done in the NFL…

          • #7

            He won’t be done. Just a career backup. Pretty good living

          • Will

            Might suit him better, who knows….I still like to see him start a few more times and some more deep passes out of him.

          • #7

            Soon as he earns the job he will get another shot. Vick earned the job. He should start when healthy for the entire season

          • Will

            MV#7 is who I have supported since Day 1. I have MV#7 Jersey. I prefer Foles as #2 over everyone else.

          • Richard Colton

            And when will Vick be healthy for an entire season? We taking the way back machine to 2003?

          • #7

            It will play out sir. Either way.

          • Richard Colton

            Unreal. Vick has shown so much that you want to bring him back again. OK – so the knock on Foles was that he couldn’t make certain throws – didn’t show that he could do it vs. Tampa Bay, showed he couldn’t do it vs. Dallas. What was the knock on Vick? Getting older…injury prone…prone to bad habits…check to all three this year.

            You really want him as your week one starter next season? Well, of course YOU do, but for fans of the franchise, it sets us back.

          • #7

            Ok here’s the last time man.

            I’m fine with drafting a QB. If it’s JF, he needs to sit for a year. Again, you guys are acting like these QBs coming out are guaranteed stars, especially you.

            You seem to be a football man unless you’re talking to me. I like a veteran QB if he can still play. Call me old school if you want. No need to get rid of a player if they can play. You want Vick gone EVEN IF HE CAN STILL PLAY and that is our issue.

            You call it “idol worship”. I call it being smart. If that rook comes in and rips it up, START HIM. If not, let him learn under a vet. A HUMBLED Vick that would be a team player.

            How is that a flawed thought? Because I’m “old school” and you’re not? That makes you right?

          • Will

            Johnny Football is a beer guzzling idiot off the feild, well documented, the Eagles will pass…poor character….

          • #7

            He needs a mentor. If he doesn’t accept the help then he will be out of the league.

            Not sure he’s special enough to be given a lot of chances. Dude barely weighs 10 pounds it looks like and arm strength doesn’t look NFL calibur…from the eye test at least

          • Richard Colton

            Because I don’t see Vick ever accepting a backup role. He is still a top 20 QB, and deserves a chance to start. If we were the 49ers or the Seahawks, I’d take a chance on an old vet. If the Eagles go 6-10, 8-8. Vick being back forces a QB competition and forces the new guy to beat a top 20 QB out of the gate. Not fair. Then what? We wait between 4 & 12 games to see him? When rookie QBs learn by playing in the new NFL? Sets the franchise back another year.

          • #7

            Well Richard that’s why I always say “it will play out either way”. It would be up to Vick man. Really no need for hypotheticals.

            I do get your point man. I really do. I’m just old school man. No guarantee these guys are ready to play

          • Richard Colton

            it’s Dick.

          • #7

            Yep, my bad Dick

  • Will

    So Foles laid an egg. Big deal it happens to the best of QB’s now and then. Not ready to give up on Foles just because of one bad game.

    • knighn

      I was team Foles.
      - First off, there’s Vick. As said above, “As much as he helps this team when healthy, he can’t be relied on week to week let alone down the line.” That pretty much sums up Vick at this point in his career.
      - So… the Eagles need a Franchise QB and they need to develop and progress Chip Kelly’s offense. If Foles wasn’t going to be the guy, I was hoping the Eagles could play him and build up his trade value until they could find Chip’s guy.

      After the last game, “The search for a franchise QB is back at Square One.” As Tim said, ” Quarterbacks only get so many chances to prove their case. That applies particularly to QBs without a first-round pedigree.”

      I was incredibly disappointed in Foles. He definitely choked. This was the biggest game of his career. He had a chance to potentially win the starting job and he was expected to do well. His body language gave it away right from the start of the game. Go ahead and watch him from the moment he steps onto the field. He actually looks scared. I would forgive that from him last year. Not now.

      So maybe he had a bad day. Maybe he forgot to eat his Wheaties and ate a really bad burrito or something. Maybe he partied with Dominic Brown and that D.B. ended up drugging him. Doesn’t matter. Foles might never get a chance again. The Eagles probably lost a lot of the trust and hope that had for Foles… just off that one game. I think Foles knows that… and I think that’s a big part of the reason we haven’t heard from him since that game. Maybe he’ll eventually get a chance to redeem himself, but N.F.L. stands for “Not For Long” for so many reasons.

      • Will

        For me Foles flashed enough. If Foles can improve and get confident in the deep sideline pass Foles could be awesome. Foles is a Rookie with parts of 9 games played way to early to rush to judgement or throw the towel in.

        • knighn

          Sorry…. accidentally posted before I finished typing. Let me finish up and then reply.
          EDIT: finished typing.

    • Loke1988

      You read my mind Will

  • KimbaFuzz

    Foles two victories as a starter have come against the Bucs. Against everyone else, he’s just been ok (and then terrible this past week). I agree he’s not the future. I just hope the Eagles find their QB while Shady is still in his prime.

    • Will

      Foles looked good against the Gnats off the bench…

    • southy

      Even if we agree that Foles isn’t the future, I still think we should play the kid. What are our other options? Barkley is in over his head. Vick might win us a couple more games, but we all should hope he’s not with the team next season. Playing Foles gives him more chances (deserved or not) to prove himself or at least improve his trade value. If he falls on his face a few more times we’ll be in better shape to pick up a QB in the draft.

      • Adam

        At 3-4 and only a game back in the division, it would be really dangerous for Chip to go this route. He’d risk losing the locker room if he throws up the white flag when we’re still in contention.

        It’s only a matter of time before Vick is hurt, might as well let it play out that way instead.

        • southy

          Fair enough. I keep forgetting how crap our division is. We could still make the playoffs. Longshot, but there’s a lot of season left.

      • Nah__Roots

        Uh, speak for yourself. I don’t get how you can sit there and be like “yeah, let’s just throw Foles out there again and see if he doesn’t suck as much as we all know he does.” He HAD his chance. He’s had multiple chances. He couldn’t get it done over the summer and he sure as hell didn’t help his case a week ago. We can WIN the division this year. There’s no point in wasting any more games on “maybes” and “hope-he-cans” and (my favorite) “the future”. NEWS FLASH – not every player on this team is part of the future. All they want to do is win. Don’t you? Unless Vick still doesn’t feel right going into this game you have to start him.

  • RaiderDebo

    There are winners alright: Mike Vick and his supporters. Vick has been disrespected for two years running by the media. A “QB controversy” with a scrub like Foles is beneath him. Although he shouldn’t have had to, he kicked Foles’ ass in a competition for the world to see. That should have earned him “unquestioned starter” status, but as soon as he pulled his hamstring, media dorks and Vick haters drudge up another pseudo controversy. Foles’ colossal flop against the Cowboys was indeed vindication for Vick and his supporters.

    • Will

      I am a Vick supporter, but I also see potential in Foles. How long do the Eagles keep Vick? The fact Vick doesn’t usually stay healthy for 16 games your #2 QB is gonna see playing time. I support who ever ends up under center.

      • knighn

        This guy is a Troll who used to post under the name “JamarcusGotScrewed”. Please stop feeding the Trolls.

        • Will

          who?

          • knighn

            RaiderDebo = JamarcusGotScrewed = Troll

          • Will

            Gonna get slammed for this but out of curiosity what is a Troll?

          • knighn

            No problem. “Troll” is internet slang for a person who roams Internet Discussion boards and posts nonsense hoping to rile up the actual fans. They are often obvious because they will show up on the discussion board showing allegiance to another team.

      • RaiderDebo

        Supporting whoever is under center and hoping the backup supplants the starter are two different things. Why couldn’t Foles supporters just be happy that he did his job while Vick was out? Like Frank Reich used to do for Jim Kelly back in the day? But this incessant “Foles runs the offense better, so he should start” garbage just because he threw a few screens against Tampa is complete garbage. It’s plainly obvious that Foles isn’t in the same universe as Vick as a QB, and yet the haters try to crown him. Last Sunday, they all lost and Mike Vick won. Faux controversy squashed.

    • 1972

      You make some good points. Unfortunately I get lumped in with guys like you though lol… I don’t think nicky foles is a scrub, i just think he’s Franck Reich. Serviceable but not quite good enough . I take no pleasure in him flopping, but it is what it is

    • Weapon Y

      Vick is a big scrub too. When’s the last time he won a playoff game? He’s just not as much of a scrub as Foles. In other words, he’s the shinier turd but he’s still a turd. Foles won’t replace him, but somebody has to whether it’s Bridgewater, Hundley, or Mariota.

      • knighn

        As I have already said: please stop feeding the Trolls.

        • Weapon Y

          How do you know I’m not a troll?

          • knighn

            You might be, but at least you’re not painfully obvious about it.

      • cliff henny

        bridgewater is out, he might as well have real estate agent in Jax. love mariota, like hundley, but the cost to get either is going to be insane. basically looking at top 2 or 3 rounds of 2 drafts. rg3 trade by skins could look cheap, seeing how 8-10 teams need qbs that have worse record than eagles, and we’ll probably win 3-5 more games.

        • Weapon Y

          I’m willing to offer an RG3 kind of deal to get one of those QBs. Chips offense has shown flashes of brilliance with Vick and Foles, but lacks consistency because neither is the right match for him. The most important measure in this offseason is to get the QB who is the right match. That has to happen so the offense can consistently carry the rest of the team.

          • cliff henny

            if he’s sold on Mariota, then package away. by now, who knows better than kelly whether MM transfers to nfl or not. Hundley, not sure, he’s still ranked even or ahead of MM, so take similar deal, that’d be tougher for me to swallow…rg3′s deal was massive. that’s relying on howie to hit in 3rd and 4th round like an ozzie newsome. think that part has me the most nervous.

          • anon

            The scary part is that even if we give up the world for a QB — the rest of the team isn’t that great. So probably another year or two of being an up or down team. But maybe the cap space will let us buy some guys (doubt the FO will do that since we’ll be rebuilding).

            I really wanted Vick or Foles to kill it this year.

        • Richard Colton

          not if we keep losing. Anyway, it’s still a crap shoot. Bridgewater/Mariota/Hundley – no matter how good they look, odds are one or two of them will be a complete bust in the NFL. Notoriously difficult to identify and get QBs. Thats why the franchise turnaround doesn’t really start until you have one. We don’t.

          • anon

            We’re getting more wins that TB, JAX, Giants, Rams, Vikings.

          • Richard Colton

            I’m by no means ready to tank…not when we’re one game out of 1st in a bad division. But we have 3 wins and there are 9 games left to play. If you offered me your above statement as a prop bet, I’d take it.

          • cliff henny

            we play half these bad teams. 2nd half of schedule gets pretty easy, and now with cultler and other bears injuries, that game is winnable. if defense keeps progressing, just not horrible qb play should be good 7-9 / 8-8. eagles have to really go into tank mode to get into top 10.

          • cliff henny

            truth. that’s why i keep watching manziel. still a crapshot, but if it’s just 1 pick, wont set franshise back like it did before rookie sal cap.

          • Richard Colton

            I’m starting to think you’re right Cliff. I think the CW goes against him at this point. There’s the Vince Young/Tim Tebow effect – guy has peaked in college. that will drive down draft stock. Maybe it is him.

          • cliff henny

            i’ve watch 5 games of his this yr. think everyone that is posting their fears on the guy is going off last yr, or hasnt really looked at his physical. like he’s small or not that fast or cant play from pocket. he can, it’s just the highlites on espn only show the other plays. all i know is, the guy is lighting up SEC. i read daily someone saying ‘well when hundley or mariota do it against sec talent’…well, JM is doing it weekly, for 2 yrs. if he wasnt espn’s poster boy for overhype, we’d love him

          • Adam

            I just don’t feel Chip needs a once in a generation QB to have success here. His system makes the QB. While it would be nice to have an Andrew Luck or RG3 (I’m talking greatness, not skill set) we can do really well with a Matt Ryan, Russell Wilson guy. Look what we’re doing with two really mediocre guys.

          • anon

            I think we need a mobile guy (not Vick but faster than foles) who can make quick decisions and accurate throws. Damn Alex smith is looking good right now.

          • Adam

            I agree, someone with a throw first mentality but can run. I like the Alex Smith move but I still don’t think he’s worth a 2nd round pick. Perfect for what Andy is doing but I’d rather a guy with a bit more big play potential if I’m spending that much resources. But I would definitely take him over the 3 guys we have now.

          • #7

            Wouldn’t work because of our D. The Defense carries Alex Smith. He manages the game, but not many game managers are winning SBs especially these days were defense isn’t what it used to be due to the rule changes

          • Richard Colton

            So a probowl QB, but not necessarily a star? I’d take that.

          • anon

            You and every other team w/ a losing record.

          • cliff henny

            be alot easier to be pro bowl talent when ’14 and ’15′s top 3 round arent hyjacked to get the qb. look at kaep, world beater last yr, struggling this yr cause all his recrs are hurt. not many brees’ manning’s brady’s of the world where put any 5 skill players out there and they’ll figure out how to score.

    • #7

      They MAKE it seem like we’re just Vick Supporters. I can clearly say that we supported Vick because he IS the best QB ON OUR ROSTER.

      Not one of us said he was the best in the league. He’s the best we have and in my personal opinion, we can win with him. All that crap talking about the QB “competition”…I was an inch from guaranteeing that Vick would win.

      The media, including the writers on here, had something to do with this. 2 games against winless teams and Shiel and Tim’s pretty all-22s will do the trick. Nothing against them doing their jobs and giving us this great site, but the media in this town has been trying to bury Vick for years.

      The man keeps fighting. He’s “supposed” to have been off of the team 3 times now and he’s still standing as the Starting QB for the Philadelphia Eagles. This is one of the main reasons I support Vick as our starter.

      OH…and most important, his TEAMMATES believe in him.

  • johnnysanz3

    No qb should be written off after a bad game, but the nature of the bad game was definitely concerning. If a rookie makes some good throws but makes some mistakes that lead to interceptions/etc, thats one thing, but Foles had open receivers, time in the pocket, and just missed on almost every throw he had to make. Where does that kind of inaccuracy come from.

    • cliff henny

      yeah, i wanted foles to grab the job and make it his, since it’s the best thing for the Eagles (regardless how little chance i thought there was of it happening). the nature of just how bad he played was alarming and discouraging to say the least.

      • defroe81

        ok so its ok to over look 2 good games as bad defenses but he has one bad game and we dont over look that at all and push forward. 2 games was a small sample size to annoint him the future. one off day is a good sample size to annoint him a career backk up… makes no sense to me but ok.

    • #7

      I wouldn’t say written off. He had 3 chances to win the job.

      3 strikes and you’re out

      • Will

        If Vick can’t go who would you put in at QB this year? I’ve seen enough of Barkley to write him off.

        • #7

          Foles. He’s a very very competent backup.

      • mrparabolic

        50 strikes later, Vick’s still swingin’.

        • Will

          LMAO…LOL…

  • Will

    With 7 games played this season is far from over. Vick should start if healthy. Vick may very well re-injure his hammy. I prefer Foles over Barkley.

  • southy

    “Instead, he crashed. And as he did, some Foles detractors/Vick supporters pointed at the wreckage and delivered told-you-sos to those that hitched their wagon to the second-year signal-caller”

    “A home run against the Cowboys would have been a real solid statement from Foles but something much less pretty unfolded.”

    Metaphorical follow-through? Alliteration? Highbrow stuff there Mr. McManus. We don’t deserve you.

  • 1972

    I keep reading how we cant rely on vick( which is true) but foles has missed games due to injury his first 2 seasons as well.
    So what makes him more reliable?

    • knighn

      Once is an incident.
      Twice is coincidence.
      Three times or more establishes a clear trend.
      ————–
      I’m a big fan of “sample size” but I can’t entirely disagree with you. Foles has gotten hurt too often in too few games to be considered reliable, especially considering that at least one of those injuries was due to his play (held the ball far too long).
      -
      Still, he’s probably considered a more reliable option because he’s not small, and he’s not a 33 year-old, injury-prone QB. He’s only a 24 year-old, (apparently) injury-prone QB.

      • Will

        Foles is far Superior to Barkley if Vick is hurt, so I think we will see more of Foles before season is over. I like to see at least 16 full games before I start passing judgement.

        • anon

          Don’t need to see full 16, but hopefully will see 2 more. That said did you see the TB game last night? They are TERRIBLE. It’s not like he beat an actual contender — that team is properly 0-7.

          • Will

            He played in parts of 9 games, 6-7 would be nice, at least 2-3 more games to know what you have in Nick Foles.

          • cliff henny

            i’ll give you credit…you have more patience than me. that cowboy game really soured me.

          • Will

            Yeah maybe to much adrenaline. Foles lack of accuracy and not making the Deep outside passes concerns me. Foles has a chance if and when he gets in the rest of the year. Foles lays more eggs after that I’m gonna be screaming for Mariota to run Chip’s offense.

          • cliff henny

            the guy missed on every type of throw you can imagine. short, deep, seams, ins out curls, and on top of it, was even scared to throw it. people can crush barkley’s ints, but at least the guy let it fly.

          • #7

            Yep you’re right about that. I’ll give Barkley that. He wasn’t scared like Foles was.

          • anon

            Yeah he had more completions to cowboys than Romo did.

          • #7

            LOL I know man. Looking back, I’m just glad that he threw the damn ball and not run (in quicksand) to the sideline and take sacks

      • 1972

        If he didn’t hold the ball so long he probably would be starting Sunday.
        I still cant believe he played that bad.
        if it wasn’t nerves what else could it have been?
        I haven’t seen qb play that bad since mike mcmahon

        • knighn

          See my previous post (repsonse to Will).

        • #7

          “if it wasn’t nerves what else could it have been?”

          FEAR

          • Will

            Too much Adeline it happens…It was the spotlight, Division game, for the Division lead, at home…The teabag broke…..

          • #7

            How can you even say that? You know how he was feeling? And you would accept that reasoning? This is the NFL.

            Ain’t no time for that

          • Will

            Well I hope for Nick Foles sake he gets a few more chances. The thing is Foles is great off the bench. So it is either nerves, anxiety, or something else. Pressure he puts on himself knowing he’s gonna start, not sure yet. Certainly not good whatever it was.

          • #7

            It couldn’t have been the defense??

          • Will

            Could be Monty Kiffin saw what I saw and took away the run game and the middle of the feild so in that sense yes it was the Defense. Forced Foles to make the throws to the outside.

          • #7

            That’s what it appeared to be a few times in the passing game, yes. He missed throws over the middle and outside. Hell he missed everywhere.

            I’m not on the Foles hype train…well not sure it’s a train anymore. Train ran out of diesel after two weeks, BUT I did not expect him to play this badly. I expected him to beat Dallas and he had 3 TDs that he left on the field from being too scared to throw the football.

          • Will

            LMAO….something was off, Foles had no accuracy, was he drugged? Who knows….that’s why I need to see a couple more games to make sure he’s just a back up. That pass to Avant in the Endzone is what disturbs me the most like WTF, Avant was wide open….

          • #7

            You saw the all-22s didn’t you?

            Foles was looking right at them running wide open!

            Those all-22s = SCARED to me.

            If he was concussed early in the game and didn’t tell anyone, what does that say about him as a teammate? Selfish maybe? i say that because back in the Arizona game at the Linc back in 2011, Vick had a rib injury and he didn’t tell anyone (I think)…and he was promptly labeled as selfish. Just a thought

          • Will

            Saw the 22′s on here, taped the game. He took some nasty hits in the pocket. Just was out of sorts. Maybe injured his hand, arm, elbow, shoulder, something was off.

          • #7

            Could be…

            You have to tell someone that you’re injured, right? I can see if it’s minor, but if what you say is true, it was not minor and it cost us a sure victory and wasted a good performance by the defense

          • Will

            How so? Barkley coming in sooner wouldn’t have saved the day!

          • #7

            ………….

          • mrparabolic

            Maybe Monty Kiffin figured out that the way to beat Nick Foles is to give him time and open receivers.

  • Will

    Looks like Foles won’t be an option this week against the Gnats. If Vick can’t start or gets injured. Barkley up, I wonder how many INT’s by Barkley before GJ Kinne gets his shot.

    • DEBO 215

      Barkley is so bad. I’d rather see them just run the read option all day with GJ Kinne or a guy like Anthony Dixon. It sure as hell beats watching Barkley throw it to the other team all day.
      If he gets to play for more then 1 quarter, he might throw 10 int’s.

      • Will

        LMAO I saw Barkley in person, absolutely no zip on his ball. So slow every one is a DB went dream sailing out like a balloon!

  • DEBO 215

    Foles isn’t anymore reliable then Vick is and he is just not a starting NFL QB. Chip should know better then to mess with the “Andy Reid Projects”. Vick is serviceable for now to bridge the gap until they can draft their guy, but to think for even half a second that Foles is anything more then Kevin Kolb 2.0 is downright foolish. He’s another mid-round, project QB that will never be anything more then a better then average backup.
    I’d put money on it that Chip goes all in for Marcus Mariota or Johnny Manziel in the upcoming draft. Mariota is his guy. He runs this offense to perfection at Oregon and has a great skill set. Manziel has all types of problems off the field but is a scary athlete on it and would be really scary in this offense. I wouldn’t even be surprised if Michael Vick is back next year on another one year deal as a backup, even if they do draft their guy. This offense just doesn’t work with Foles. You can say how he looked great against Tampa all you want. I would’ve looked good against Tampa. That team has given up on Schiano.
    Based on the expectations coming into this season, I’m actually very happy with the Eagles so far. The defense is evolving and they played their best game of the year against Dallas on a day when the offense couldn’t stay on the field and couldn’t score points. DeSean is a top 5 WR and Shady leads the league in rushing. They’re actually in the hunt for the division right now.

    Right now, we just need to be patient. We know the QB for the future isn’t here. We’ve got Vick for now. Ride out the season with 7 at the helm, and let’s see where we end up.

    • Will

      I agree ride MV#7 this year, evaluate Foles# 9 as well this year. At the end of the season if Nick Foles has a few more starts or significant playing time decide at the end of the year. I think you go with the current Oregon QB if it comes to that Mariota.

      • DEBO 215

        I’m a big fan of Mariota. I think his skill set and knowledge of the offense coupled with the weapons around him could be a lot of fun next year. You always want to keep evaluating the current talent, but I think I’ve seen enough of Foles. He could be decent enough somewhere else, but we haven’t drafted “the guy” since McNabb and I think it’s time. I want a first round QB with tremendous upside.

        • Will

          I like the fact Mariota knows this offence period. Hopefully Chip learned from last year’s draft about guys not falling to you. So if there is a must player go up and get your QB of the future…

        • Brian

          Problem is, he’s a top five pick next year.

          • DEBO 215

            I think so too. My hope is that Bridgewater, Hundley and Manziel force him down the list a bit…maybe even Boyd too. We’ll see.

          • cliff henny

            no way…will be qb feeding frenzy in top 5. too many teams needing qbs. bridgewater is 1 or 2, and even if teams at 3-5 dont want a qb, about 8 teams picking from 6-18 will want to move up.

          • DEBO 215

            Yeah but Clowney figures into this too. Teams could be trying to trade up to 1 for Clowney with a team looking to move back to say 3 or 4 to pick up a QB.
            This draft is going to be absolutely insane. They just have to go for it.

          • Richard Colton

            Could be another ’99. Just hope we get a McNabb and not a Cade McNown

          • DEBO 215

            I’m going to call it right now: The Rams get Clowney. Two picks that will both be top 10, might even have two in the top 5.

          • cliff henny

            i’m watcing every oregon, ucla t a&m game i can find. i just wonder when seeing the ‘do whatever to get mariota’ posts know exactly what the means. rg3′s trade was only 6th to 2nd and it cost couple 1st, 2nds, 3rd and 5th…eagles will need to move 15-3or 4, with a ton of competition. i just dont see marioti being 5 or 6 players better than manziel. neither team is winning that trade this yr.

    • knighn

      People do know that Mike Vick was an “Andy Reid Project” at one point, right?

      • DEBO 215

        He was also the first pick of the draft and is a freakish athlete. He wasn’t necessarily a Reid project as much as he was a low risk/high reward signing that honestly has paid off more then they expected at this point.

        • #7

          If we draft a QB, what’s wrong with the rook learning under a Vet? People act like doing that is a problem now

          • Richard Colton

            Watch how the Vick crew will try to hoodwink you into another season with their idol under center. Team doesn’t matter, just as long as Vick starts. 2010-2011-2012-2013…its groundhog day

            As long as our options are Vick/Foles/Barkley – we don’t have our QB. We need a franchise guy, or we’re just running in place. Vick isn’t a backup anything. And this “learning under a vet thing” is one of the biggest cliches is modern sports.

          • Will

            If Foles doesn’t show something real special and fast. I believe we mortgage the farm and go after Mariota in next years draft.

          • #7

            You guys are making Mariota out to be the next Luck.

          • DEBO 215

            He’s just the best fit for this team. Great skillset and he already knows the offense.

          • #7

            Hey nothing wrong with that at all. That’s great. I just don’t do hype much. They still have to play. I just like a veteran QB on my squad. Nothing more

          • Will

            What we have doesn’t look to be the long term solution.

          • RaiderDebo

            Hell, I’m not sure how good Luck really is.

          • #7

            Easy now. That man can play. He won’t have Manning numbers, but who does?

          • cliff henny

            i’ll guarentee he sees an afc champ game or 2 if he stas healthy. luck is real deal

          • #7

            Especially with that DEFENSE

          • RaiderDebo

            I just think the hype on this guy is way over the top. Not a huge stat guy, but it’s hard to ignore that he had a 77 QB rating last year. Dude threw 18 picks. They brought Pep Hamilton in to run the ball more and have Luck do less. They’re winning now with ball control and defense. Just not seeing the greatness everyone else sees.

          • #7

            You have a point there, but I would take Luck over any young QB in the league. Especially over the Diva RG3

          • RaiderDebo

            RG3 is definitely a diva. Did you see him stay face down after a sack against the bears? Drama queen. But he’s a pure badass. He was arguably the best QB in the NFL last year. Sucks that he’s already rounding into form. Will be very tough to beat the 2nd time around.

          • Maggie

            ELI doesn’t have Manning numbers! Lol. Just 2 rings.

          • #7

            ……….

          • DEBO 215

            I don’t think he even gets the opportunity to do so. He blew it IMO.

          • Will

            Hamstrings take time to heal not gonna be surprised if Vick pulls it again and is out 4-6 weeks next time….

          • cliff henny

            the only reason i’d resign vick is so it doesnt show hand before draft. without vick on roster, how in the world could eagles make a trade. if i was gm’g other team, i’d ask for 2 whole drafts as starting point after seeing cowboys game. could live with another similar contract and if eagles end up with top 5 qb or let manziel drop, they can easily move on from vick. if qb is taken in 1st rd next yr, he has to play.

          • Maggie

            As I posted previously, give Vick a coaching internship. Then he can mentor young guys and still be respected. Especially if he does it well. Don’t forget, other players like Vick and respond to him. Important in an assistant coach.

          • Richard Colton

            insanely idiotic, even for you

          • #7

            Doug Flutie – Drew Brees
            Joe Montana – Steve Young
            Chris Chandler – Steve McNair
            Kurt Warner – Eli Manning
            Doug Flutie – Phil Rivers
            Doug Pederson – McNabb
            Chris Chandler – Vick
            Favre – Rodgers
            Bledsoe – Romo
            Plummer – Cutler
            Vick – Johnny Football???

            It has worked sir. These are just a few off the top of my head

          • Will

            Vick, Mariota,Foles….Johnny Football has off the field issues , Eagles big on character…no party animals need apply…

          • DEBO 215

            I’m starting Mariota week 1 if they get him.

          • cliff henny

            the cost to get mariota or hundley, either would have to start.

          • Will

            If he wins the completion in camp go for it, Vick at 34 would be the best back up at #2, with Foles at #3

          • Richard Colton

            I stopped reading your list after Joe Montana-Steve young. Great model of “rookie learning under a vet” #1 – Steve Young wasn’t a rookie when San Fran got him, #2 there was ZERO mentorship that happened. It set the franchise back.

          • #7

            He was still a young QB as far as experience. Young was about as reckless as Vick as a runner at TB.

            i said it was off of the top of my head. Whether there was mentorship or not between Young and Montana, I would bet 100 bucks that Young learned from Joe and he said so himself

          • Richard Colton

            This is just factually incorrect. Their relationship was hostile. Montana hated Young and did everything to freeze him out and block his development. It ultimately worked out for the franchise – a Superbowl, but how much of Young’s development was wasted on an aging pre-KC Montana? Enough for a second title?

            I’m not suggesting that Vick will do that. Vick is 1000% more mature than Joe Montana. But if you get a guy who will be “your guy” moving forward, better to play him out of the gate.

          • #7

            We know that Richard. Steve said he still learned from him. You can learn from people just by watching. Also, their relationship improved towards the end.

            Yes it was hostile in the beginning.

            “But if you get a guy who will be “your guy” moving forward, better to play him out of the gate.”

            Well…sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn’t. Total crap shoot.

          • DEBO 215

            It depends. Like I said above, if nothing is done to address the position in the offseason and Vick/Foles/Barkley are their only options next year…then yeah Vick is the guy again. That said, I doubt this happens and I also will be very unhappy with this if it does.

          • Richard Colton

            OK – how does the Roseman/Kelly regime justify going two full seasons without the most important piece on their roster? Not saying your wrong, saying its almost impossible to do from their perspective.

          • DEBO 215

            They can play the “Well we tried but failed” card. If they can’t get a QB in the draft and there’s nothing on the market, they kind of have to role with what they’ve got.
            Like I said, it’s the least likely scenario and the worst scenario. I highly doubt they come out of the first round of this draft without a QB. I just hope it’s the right one and they don’t end up reaching or giving up too much.

          • anon

            I don’t think ti’s crazy. I really think if Vick is healthy we beat Dallas and the rest of our schedule is winnable. Maybe i think the Eagles are better all around than we are. But we lost to two great teams and (now) 2 ok teams.

            Frankly i think we are the type of team that could beat a team like KC. And i think once our defense is better we are the type of team that would beat wild card teams. In the NFC i think only the Saints, 49ers and Seahawks are better teams than us.

          • Richard Colton

            agree to both points. put me into the “win as many games as you can as long as your team is in the race” category. KC is ripe for a fall – great defense, but how do they score with that offense?

          • Maggie

            It’s a cliché because it sometimes works. Especially if the vet is a WILLING teacher.

          • Richard Colton

            would you say it’s “pavlovian” Maggie? get real. we have
            coaches. they coach. the players competing for the same job aren’t helping each other learn. That’s fan fantasy. This isn’t Canada, people aren’t that accommodating.

          • DEBO 215

            34 year old Vick is a humbled man that I think would take a backup job if that’s all that was out there. I don’t see a big market for him as a starter elsewhere after this season.
            I don’t want him as our starting QB after this season. I want them to do whatever it takes to get a QB at the top of this draft and whoever that is should start right away.
            Now let’s say they do NOTHING to address the QB position in the draft and they have Vick, Foles, Barkley heading into next year…then yeah I’d still want Vick to start. I find this scenario both the worst and the least likely.

  • Will

    I like the fact Mariota knows this offence period. Hopefully Chip
    learned from last year’s draft about guys not falling to you. So if
    there is a must player go up and get your QB of the future…

    • cliff henny

      it’s not like hundley manziel or boyd would be lost when kelly hands them a playbook. let’s just be clear, the cost to get mariota will be at least 2 1st, 2 2nds, probably more than that, along with more 3-5th rdrs…it’s going to hurt. if he misses, holy smokes

      • Will

        Depends how bad you want him. Thing is Mariota knows this system, might not flourish in someone else’s Offensive system. I mean if at the end of the year Foles hasn’t showed anything you have to go in the draft thinking QB. Vick may or may not be here next year.

        • cliff henny

          the system isnt astrophysics, plenty of guys can learn. i agree, the easiest guy to project is mariota because he is running darn near same offense. it’s not like projecting andre ware into nfl offenses 20 yrs ago, ucla, clemson texas a&m running similar enough to see hundley and manziel would look good. boyd is garbage.

          • anon

            This assumes we don’t name Barkely the starter next year and take our lumps.

          • cliff henny

            than just take qb in teens (assuming manziel will be best qb available) and let them fight it out. can miss on 1st rd talent w/ rookie wage scale, cant miss if mortgage draft. i just dont see MM or BH as 6 or 7 players better than JM, plus the risk of leveraging 2 drafts.

  • #7

    I can’t lie. If we can just make the playoffs….I believe we can get hot and do some things.

    Ever since I saw that Giants pull off that 9-7 record and make a SB run makes me believe it can happen.

    Not predicting anything people!

  • Maggie

    Vick is not stupid. He knows his career is near an end. Why not give him a QB coaching internship and if that works out he could become a quarterback coach somewhere? He would be respected and still be part of a team. Aaron Rodger’s coach played in the CFL and he seems to be pretty good at his current position. I like Vick for a couple of reason’s besides his unreal arm strength. He learns from his mistakes in life and he has a sense of humor. Both valuable commodities in a coach. AND the players like and follow him.

    • EaglePete

      ya hes a great person post prison, no doubt. I dont think hes ready to just call it quits and start in the coaching world. Even if in Philly it doesnt work, he can easily either start elsewhere or def be a great backup for a few more years. Hes still better than a lot of starters in this league.

  • Loke1988

    The whole frigging offense INCLUDING the guru Chippah crashed last Sunday. Firgging Vick couldn’t even complete a pass in the quarter before last he suited up yet he gets chance upon chance upon chance upon chance. Two career playoff wins in a ten year career but he keeps getting chances and repeating the same mistakes.

    But let’s all give up on Foles after what happened last week..

    • #7

      Ok we will