Twitter Mailbag: On QBs, Leadership And Reid

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From @Ryeboat: what is your take on the QB situation for this year and beyond. The eagles have to draft one of the top guys in 2014 right?


First off, sounds like Michael Vick will be ready for the Giants game.

That's good news for the short-term, assuming the hamstring holds up and he can make it through.

Long-term remains a giant question mark for this franchise. Nick Foles came up small in the biggest opportunity of his young career. It's not enough to write him off, but it has stripped away a lot of the optimism that surrounded the quarterback after 1 1/2 weeks of quality play.

I do think the Eagles will target a quarterback in the upcoming draft. I thought that before Foles struggled and certainly still feel that way now. As I've stated before, the team is looking at the Seattle and San Francisco models: build a sound team largely through the draft and continue to take shots at the quarterback position until a franchise guy is identified. If it's Vick, Foles, Matt Barkley or someone still playing college ball, the job is open for whoever wants to run away with it.

And yes, I believe Chip Kelly would like to get his hands on Marcus Mariota. But who knows if they can pull that off.

From @sumpnclehvuh: I know Chip is not a bulletin board guy, but any chance they use a vid of Andy Reid's dance for motivation?

No. But this question does give us the opportunity to post the .gif!

I demand that Kelly mimics this scene if the Eagles beat the Giants Sunday.

Pretty unbelievable that Reid's Chiefs are the last undefeated team remaining, though, huh? Hard to believe, Harry.

From @DanAngelo1123: are the Eagles plagued by poisinous leaders AKA DeSean Jackson and Shady McCoy? #armflail #growup

The term "poisonous leaders" is much too strong.

I will say, though, that I did not agree with the way DeSean Jackson in particular carried himself in the Dallas loss. He was frustrated and had every right to be. He was getting open and Foles couldn't deliver the ball. He's not the first receiver (or even the only receiver in that game) to show his emotions by clapping his hands together or raising his arms in the air. Or even by stewing on the bench like he did at the end of the first half.

My only point is: what good does that do your team or quarterback? Foles was clearly off. He was indecisive and wasn't showing the type of confidence that he had in the Bucs and Giants games. It would be more productive to put your own frustrations aside and encourage your quarterback, try to pick him up.

"I think everybody gets frustrated out there," said Kelly when asked about the body language. "The biggest thing when you get frustrated is do something about it.  Make it happen and continue.  I think we talked about it after the game.  We've got to stick together as a group.  It's always us against the other team.  It can't be us against us.  I'm confident this team will stick together."

Were there examples of “us against us” in that game at all?

"No, I was just answering his question on when you see body language or whatever.  That is a general statement that we'd always make."

Though it's interesting Kelly talked about it to his team after the game.

Guys like Jackson and LeSean McCoy are at the points in their career where they have to be tone-setters. Generally I think they've done a pretty good job in that respect, but not so much this past week.

 

 

  • jabostick

    I love that Andy Reid .gif so much haha. As hilarious as it is, good for him for having fun again. He looked so beaten down the past couple of years.

    I thought it was uncomfortable watching Desean’s body language too. It was warranted but you’d hope they hold it together better than that. (Even Avant did it at the end after the last Barkley pick, which is unusual for him). But that’s who Desean is; he’s super emotional and, when things are going well, it’s infectious but when things aren’t he isn’t going to hold that in either.

    The offense needed a Gus Bradley ‘Do your job!” pep talk. That’s generally what it comes down to. If you do that, ‘Leadership’ (the ‘body language’ kind of leadership) doesn’t come into play

    • G_WallyHunter

      He deserves every bit of that undefeated record.. real happy for him too. Rough couple years, both professionally and personally, Actually (believe it or not), I wouldn’t mind seeing him take Alex Smith and Co. to the superbowl and win it, shove it in Lurie’s face.

      I know I shouldn’t be saying this as an Eagles fan, but I’m saying it as an Andy Reid fan lol, I want him to win it (If the Eagles don’t, ofcourse)…

      • knighn

        No, Reid doesn’t deserve that Super Bowl win. Reid forced Lurie to promote him to the de facto GM. Reid made the decisions that led to the 4-12 team. If he was smart he would have stuck to coaching and had someone else build the team for him. He wasn’t smart. He was arrogant.
        Reid has had little to do with building that Chief’s team. If he wins there it will be a smack in the face to the city of Philadelphia and every Eagles fan. If Reid was ever capable of winning a championship, he should have done it here. He’s a Chief now, so f him.

        • G_WallyHunter

          I’m aware he inherited that team, who isn’t. I’m saying, for what he gave Eagles fans for a decade, he deserves every bit of that record (and if he gets a ring, then a ring).. So what if the last 4 or 5 years of Eagles football have been irrelevant, he was real close to it, 6 times in fact. Like I said, he’s had a rough couple of years, especially with son dying. I’m happy he’s happy, am I pissed that he wasn’t able to do this with the Eagles? Of course, but that’s the past who cares.
          If it’s a smack in the face then it’s a smack in the face, he deserves it, what’s he supposed to do not have his team win the championship? He inherited 7 pro bowlers and a stout D (which has most of those PBowlers), good for him, that’s how the cards fell. I think a lot of Philly fans will be happy for him, but probably twice more will be pissed about it just like yourself

          • knighn

            I am a passionate Eagles fan, but I am not completely irrational. He deserves the record he gained here, both the big wins and the even bigger losses. It’s not his fault that he came in here as a guy who had never been a head coach and had never been a coordinator… on any level. It is his fault that the issues he had in 1999 still seemed to be an issue in 2012. He never “did a better job”. He just kept making the same mistakes, and even got worse. It is his fault that he had the arrogance to think that he could handle both GM and Head Coaching duties… when he couldn’t, and the quality of the teams he built degraded slowly from 2005 through 2012. My God: how may picks did he totally blow in rounds 1, 2 and 3?! And it is absolutely his fault that he had the audacity to promote his O-line Coach to Defensive Coordinator.

            There is nothing in the world that can bring back his son. There is nothing in the world that can replace that loss, not even a Lombardi Trophy (just ask Tony Dungy). So as far as I’m concerned: he doesn’t need to win in. It won’t do anything about his son, and may even make him said that his son isn’t there to share it with him.

            If it does anything: it will just give Andy an opportunity throw it in the face of Philadelphia and the Philadelphia media (who can ask stupid questions sometimes, but often are just asking the questions that we fans would want to ask).

            I am an Equal Opportunity Eagles fan: as far as I’m concerned, if the Eagles can’t win the Lombardi, nobody should. I do know, logically, that it cannot be that way, but that’s the way it should be. Every Sunday I want to watch the Eagles win and 31 other NFL teams to lose.

    • anon

      I don’t totally blame them. There was a lot riding on that game. I think several players were encouraging — did you see Shady trying to give Nick a pep talk. Given how terrible we’ve been the last couple of years, and at home over the last year I think everyone really wanted that win. Victory seemed to be soooooooooo close all the way until 4th quarter and receivers just couldn’t get the ball. Frankly I think the team has done a great job of sticking together through the diversity but I wouldn’t take too much away from it.

      • jabostick

        Yeah, I totally empathize with the frustration. And judging by Sheil’s twitter this morning, it wasn’t as if it was one missed throw and D-Jax getting pissy.

        Having said that, the negative body language never does any good. You don’t even have to be super positive/encouraging either. A “Hey Nick, get your shit together, you’re better than this” is more productive than arm flailing.

        Maybe they tried that too, though…

      • #7

        Have to remember this is a WR we’re talking about. Hell Rice used to do the same type things when they don’t get the ball. I’m sure it happens a lot more in the NFL than people think

    • shaylynnvacca321

      my Aunty Eva just got a new
      Volkswagen Golf by working parttime online. why not try this out J­a­m­2­0­.­ℂ­o­m

      • jabostick

        But WHO does Aunty Eva want to be the Eagles QB in 2014??

  • borntosuffer

    Quoting Richie Ashburn – nice.

  • cheapmeat

    Wasn’t it just last week that Foles was talking about his footwork, how he doesn’t worry about it and hasn’t tried to change it?

    We’re lucky none of our WRs blew an ACL a la Reggie Wayne…

    At least Barkley’s arm looked decent, can always work on the decision making/vision.

    • cheapmeat

      I can’t even take myself seriously with that Barkley comment

      • cliff henny

        dont be so hard on him and yourself. yeah, i saw the 4 picks in 3 possessions too, but compared to foles, thought he looked good in pocket, ball was coming out well-combo of release and better arm stength, and he made couple really good throws into tight nfl windows. PA-LENTY to work on, but not 100% failure when put in an un-winnable situation.

        • cheapmeat

          Sure but if all they have to do is roll a LB under the coverage, we’re f’d

          • cliff henny

            he was tossing them to safeties and corners too…let’s not pigeon hole him to lbrs only, he was equal opportunity pick machine.
            .
            still, wasnt alot there, but in odd way thought he looked ok. garbage outcomes. maybe i was just searching for a smidgeon of bright spot after crappy offensive day

          • cheapmeat

            I hear you, we’re looking at the same shit (performance) from opposite sides of the fence. If this article was about the defense, maybe I’d feel more optimistic.

          • BlindChow

            It was his first start off the bench. Talk about small sample size.

    • KimbaFuzz

      Unfortunately or WRs did that before the season began… :(

  • Andy
    • Soybot

      This makes me smile every time I watch it. Which is about every 10 minutes over the past 24 hours.

    • http://abigbuttandasmile.com/ A Big Butt and a Smile

      I’m happy for him. He looks rejuvenated and happy. Good for him.

      • anon

        Cheesesteaks get boring after 14 years. that BBQ is no joke.

  • Not sure what I saw

    I think Foles got his bell rung in the 1st quarter and didn’t say anything. Those hits looked harder than the one that eventually knocked him out of the game. It would explain his sudden cautious play and misfires.

    • anon

      that could be it, got those happy feet.

    • Uncle Carm

      That’s what I was thinking. He got plowed on one early play.

  • JofreyRice

    I feel like the 49ers and Seahawks are defensive teams. If the model is to run the ball, and play really tough, physical D, I think it’s easier to pursue a franchise QB the way they did. When the team’s identity is offense, and putting 11 guys on the field to score as many points as possible, I think you kind of need to do whatever you can to get a guy you believe in at QB.

    • cliff henny

      if they dont extend vick, it’s going to be pretty obvious no matter how much howie and kelly spin foles/barkley that eagles are targeting qb. my worry is the ‘whatever you can do’ part…if it takes a washington redskin rg3 type trade, ouch, not like they dont need top end talent everywhere

      • Token

        If thats what it takes they have no choice but to do it. The current era hangs in the balance. Kelly needs his QB. Thats the big step to this thing. Though I dont think it would take THAT much to trade up.

        Vick will be gone. Keeping him and drafting a QB would be a disaster. This team didnt need the Vick distraction this year and it sure as hell doesnt need it going forward.

        • Richard Colton

          well, you and I disagree about who should be playing this year – I think it still should be Vick for a number of reasons. But I doubt very much you’ll get anyone suggesting he will be the QB next year. It just can’t happen, not in year two of the rebuild.

          • Dutch

            Titans, Texans, Browns, Vikings, Jaguars, Cardinals, and Bucs along with the Raiders and Eagles will be looking for franchise QBs in this draft.

            If the Eagles don’t resign Vick who will be the Eagles QB next season? Even if Kelly manages to package a pick for a better selection why trade Vick instead of keeping him as an alternate in case of an injury to Kelly’s hand picked guy?

            What’s the football logic in your reasoning that can’t happen?

            I am sure you have no logical football reason that can’t happen but I’ve been wrong before.

          • cliff henny

            that’s my huge concern, the cost to get into top 5 for mariota or hundley could be insane. i’m seriously warming to manziel, somehow people are acting like SEC isnt nfl jr on here.

          • Dutch

            That’s just a matter of knowing good solid football when it’s played. The SEC is the top conference in America for a reason.

          • cliff henny

            everyone is oversold of bridgewater, who is playing sister’s of the poor, and not putting up crazy numbers, where manziel is killing SEC, not once in awhile, but every game, and getting repeat business, like alabama. he hung damn near 100 in 2 meetings. guy 6 foot, 210 run 4.4 40, and is only 20.

          • anon

            So mike vick reincarnated?

          • Dutch

            I would not say that, but he is a dual threat QB meant to run an option offense and can hit the long ball.

          • Dutch

            I like Manziel simply because he fits the Eagles like a glove. He’s not an exclusive pocket passer but he can throw the ball and get better than average results. The kid has the moxie you look for in a starting QB and I’ve never seen a look of confusion or fear in his eyes no matter how big the moment. He’s a guy that will come through when the chips are down but more importantly, those guys lining up besides him believe in him to get the job done.

          • cliff henny

            think we’ve seen that kelly is putting nice spin on not needing mobile qb. maybe, but if he doenst have wheels, he better have an arm. learning yr for kelly, he’s seeing the differences between college and nfl. i see manziel being great fit, along with mariota and hundley, but he wont take 2 or 3 1st, probably and 2nd or 2 to get. is mariota 4 top teir players better than manziel? see how ‘skins make out over next 2 or 3 yrs without have top end of draft.

          • Richard Colton

            the glove that wears the crown

          • Chali

            Exactly Dutch… I think they are forced to extend Vick one more year as *INSURANCE* … Too many teams need QB’s that even a Redskins type trade for the QB won’t happen. Again, Vick hatred overriding logic. I’m sure this will be mistaken for me as a Vick apologist or something. Unless Barkley shows us something next year, there is a possibility of Vick being our guy again next year.

          • Richard Colton

            to be a backup? you think Vick signs to be a backup? I don’t see that happening, but to answer your question. I want to turn the page. I think CK looked at the options handed him last offseason as Vick, Foles, or Geno/EJ, and took the best of the bunch with an eye to this year.

            Sell me MV as a one year stop-gap? OK. 2 years? no way.

          • Dutch

            You may not have the necessary foresight to put a team together, but have you witnessed any incident where Vick has proven not to be a team player and, if no what do you draw those conclusions you make on Vick? What page to turn, this kid has been no distraction since playing with the Eagles.

            If Kelly is as smart as he appears he will pay no attention to the articles written in making his evaluations on who he keeps as players capable of getting the job at hand done. Football is not a personality contest.

          • Richard Colton

            did being a better QB than Nick Foles turn MV into a legitimate option at QB for the future? unreal Delta, even for you.

          • Dutch

            Vick isn’t the future, he’s not expected to be, but he’s damn sure a legitimate back up Option QB for Kelly’s Offense, if you learned anything this week you should have come away convinced that Foles has no future running Kelly’s offense and no future in Philly.

            Kelly has the No.2 offense in the NFL not 8 months removed from the University of Oregon, it’s a mistake to believe Kelly is going to shelve his Offense instead of looking for the pieces to put in place to get the maximum out of his system.

            You can believe Kelly is definitely sold on the idea he belongs at this level and can make a difference.

          • Richard Colton

            and you still think Kelly runs the option so…

          • Nik

            If you think Vick will sign for backup money when there are more than half a dozen teams scratching for a starter, you may want to jump on board the next concussion lawsuit.

          • anon

            vick’s a fa so no trade. raiders might stick w pryor.

          • Dutch

            Pryor is turning out to be a fair option. He moves the team and so far has been productive. The Raiders are fascinating to watch this year. Pryor is another winning QB from a major college team. However, the Raiders have speed to go deep and a pocket passers is not out of the question for the Raiders if one becomes available.

        • cliff henny

          takes more when the team you are talking with teams knowing you have no choice. contract negotiation 101, better have believable plan b.
          .
          cant see them keeping vick. why have him sign 3 yr deal only to void last 2 asap. eagles thinking is generally easy to follow, just look at contracts/cap

        • KimbaFuzz

          I don’t think there was a “Vick distraction” at all. The distraction has come when people have tried to remove him as the QB. But he hasn’t brought anything negative that I’ve seen in terms of distractions.

          • #7

            “Vick Distraction”. Not aware of one except for the ones that are conjured up on these threads

        • biteme

          Dude you know nothing about pro football. Nothing! You should just stop commenting. Please spare the rest of us your moronic blathering.

          • Token

            Ok, thanks for your insight.

            So, you dont need a QB in pro football then right?

      • JofreyRice

        I agree they need an upgrade in talent at a lot of positions (I wonder why?) but I do think adding the right QB can change a franchise’s trajectory quicker than anything else. The one time I think trading the farm for a guy is worth it.

        • cliff henny

          6 months ago, i probably liked howie…after countless posting you have turned me to dark side…howie getting right guy is the issue. hopefully he just gets out of kelly’s way. idk if kelly knows any more, but let him sink or swim with his guy.

          • JofreyRice

            YES! I KNEW I COULD MAKE A DIFFERENCE!

          • cliff henny

            lol…hopefully i learned something, my goal is to get token to budge on manziel

          • JofreyRice

            Good luck, I don’t know what to make of Manziel myself–haven’t really had a chance to watch him this year. Based on last year, I’m incline to agree with Token, but you just never can tell. One of the things that makes it fun.

          • cliff henny

            he is playing alot more under control this year. guy is lighting up SEC, there’s alot of nfl talent he’s going against. i get he needs to stop the jumpballs (or get a c johnson type, then toss away) and cant cutback runs against grain in and around lbrs, but this can be coached. what he’s been doing alot this yr, and wish vick did it, is rolling out, reversing field and resetting blockers, then delivering deep. just think he is ‘in play’ cause i do think he’ll be 10-15 pick range. just warming up to him in preparation

          • JofreyRice

            I’m sure I’ll develop an opinion on him at some point. I’ll end up watching youtube cutups after the season.

          • cliff henny

            he’s 4th on my list, not acting like he’s my 1st choice. (is growing on me, and teasing token is fun) dont even care about bridgewater, he should have RE agent in JAX on retainer. i’m all-in with mariota, but if he’s just rediculously expensive, wont go apeshit if they settle for hundley. guy has all the raw tools and great leader. was choosen as a captain before ever playing reg season down.
            .
            but, been an eagle fan for 35 yrs…have a 6th sense. like when they’re up 27-7 in 3rd, and just feel a 28-27 loss…that’s how i feel about manziel

          • #7

            I don’t know that he’ll be able to do these things in the NFL henny. I like Johhny Football and all, but it just seems iffy

          • cliff henny

            10 months, it’ll be johnny philadelphia…f-it, i’m trademarking that today!

          • Andy124

            Manzieldelphia
            John Eagle
            JEagle
            GEagle

          • #7

            “Manzieldelphia”

            That’s pretty sweet

          • cliff henny

            where is that crazy cat? was no bigger foles backer than him, might be on suicide watch after sunday

          • #7

          • Andy124

            He sticks to igglesblitz most of the time.

          • cliff henny

            they must love him(not sure how to do sarcastic font). serious football junkies over there. not alot of lighthearted convo’s that i ever see.

          • Andy124

            He’s pretty well accepted over there. And a few of those guys are frickin hilarious. A_T_G and Baloophi… and me of course.

          • theycallmerob

            baloophi’s garbage can scouting report is internet hall of fame worthy

          • BlindChow

            Maybe he got banned again?

          • cliff henny

            every once in awhile he’d just snap, was kind of random too.

          • #7

            I can’t say I remember him…and I imagine he’s probably “snapped” at me a few times

          • cliff henny

            you’d know him, he wrote novels.

          • JofreyRice

            Was weird, guy would write 5000 word manifestos on Jarius Byrd, but couldn’t tell me why he painstakingly capitalized “FOles” every time he typed it.

          • Andy124

            He’s explained that a few times. Typed it wrong one time, autocorrects to that everytime now. Is working around it by typing Folesy instead.

          • theycallmerob


            ….
            HAHa oh man its the comments like these that are great!!! IF onLy FOles playes some more he’ll be the GOAT! lol

            Byrd for a 2nd? My friend told me its in the works already.
            …..
            I bet you ALL the eagles are the best defense by december. book it!


            -ode to geagle

          • #7

            I’ll be excited, I can’t lie, but I have my doubts man. That arm seems weak to me and he has good enough speed…I guess. He def can’t pull off thoes moves in the NFL. Dude looks like he weighs 10 pounds

          • cliff henny

            it’s not a cannon, but much better than foles or barkley. pulling off those moves in SEC. sure, he has to calm down, not saying he cant, but this isnt bridgewater type competition he’s doing all this against. he’s lighting up ‘bama, georgia, lsu, and multiple times. johnny philadelphia is not a fluke. and he gets it down the field, very similar to plays eagles are running with vick. it’s not college urban meyer’s crap that doesnt project to nfl.

          • #7

            Eh we’ll see. I’m sure we’ll get back on our disagreement streak, but the guy could come in and learn under Vick for a year. There would be no other great mentor to JF than Vick. Vick has been cocky in the old days…he’s had/still has the moves and agility…Vick just learned a bit to late how to fully harness all of that talent and he could help JF out since, whether you admit it or not, his game reminds me of a young Vick..on a lower level.

          • cliff henny

            little bit, much better passer of the ball.

          • #7

            Debatable

          • cliff henny

            in this point in college career? not really. maybe vick today vs manziel today, but he has 13 yrs on him.

          • #7

            You have to think about how good these guys are coached these days. There’s a difference. Just over ten years ago, QBs couldn’t even get in the games as rookies and now they can.

            Also, I don’t recall no other QB than Vick coming out of VA tech under Beamer that was worth a damn. Even to this day. Vick is the only VA Tech QB in the NFL. VA Tech is not exactly a QB factory

          • cliff henny

            so, it’s not debatable, it’s explainable.

          • #7

            lol ok man

          • anon

            But do you want a scramble QB? See how often Vick gets injured — you can’t think J Manzy would fare any better. Though maybe Vick could teach him up — but wonder if Manzy is too cocky to listen.

          • cliff henny

            have you watched him? he’s already calmed the scrambling down. again, depends how they scramble, like wilson, sideline or get down, sure, like rg3 turning up sidelines taking on dbs or leaping over lbrs at numbers no. there’s a way to do it safely. 10-15 yrs ago he, manziel, would have been turned into a corner (fact is why he didnt go to texas, brown said thats where he’d play him), now these types are playing and learning how to protect themselves. coaches know how to also. vick cunningham were just before their time, imagine if they’d been coached properly.

          • Token

            He keeps doing the things he does in the NFL and he will get broken in half. MAYBE if he had young Vick speed he could get away with it. But he doesnt. He has the slightest frame I remember seeing on a QB prospect.

          • #7

            Yep, what I think too. What is he? 4.6 40?

          • cliff henny

            http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/dsprofile.php?pyid=119572&draftyear=2016&genpos=QB
            40 is 4.4. right at 6 feet 210…let’s not act like he’s flutie here. can easily put 10lbs of muscle,guy is only 20.

          • cliff henny

            putting up 40+ 10 straight games in SEC, he’s doing something right. prefer Mariota over him, but i’m just warning people…been at this eagles bs for 35 yrs, i have a feeling

          • #7

            Tebow dominated the SEC too….

          • cliff henny

            in non-nfl type offense. manziel is playing in nfl type offense. it’s not a huge stretch to picture him playing for eagles, like it would to picture a ’07 tebow

          • #7

            NFL type offense? I don’t know about that. Not going to call that one since I’ve only watched a game or two.

            Say what you want about how Tebow did it, but he did it and that’s the point

          • cliff henny

            it’s a spread offense, mostly 11 personel. they put ball in johnny philadelphia’s hand more often, because why wouldnt you. he certainly can be a threat to run R/O with shady

          • #7

            Just a HUGE jump from college to pros as we both know. The windows close fast in the NFL. Honestly I’m shocked that I’m down on JF. Love dual threat QBs. I just can’t see it man

          • cliff henny

            some make it some dont…it’s certainly not an exact science. why i like duel threat, let these young guys use their legs while adjusting to nfl throwing windows. manziel plays in SEC, it’s about as close as you can get. mariota is blowing up pac 16 or 20 by now, much less passing cridentials and i’m all in.

          • #7

            JF needs to sit and learn…and hit the weights

          • Andy124

            I was under the impression they were running a version of the Air Raid offense. Then I googled “Texas A&M offensive system” and the first result was Air Raid.

          • #7

            Where is the “Air Raid” in the NFL?

            Nowhere…probably some concepts of it here and there

          • cliff henny

            sure, lot more passing than kelly’s R/O spread, but they still do some. but lot more similar than urban meyer’s spread. issue with labeling these spreads, no 2 are alike. texas a&m has calmed it’s air raid down alot this yr after kingbury went to texas tech, who really runs an air raid offense. meant more ‘picturing’, like 15-20 yrs ago trying to picturing houston’s heisman qb andre ware playing in nfl

          • pjcostello

            If you catch yourself agreeing with Token, seek immediate psychiatric assistance. Followed by large quantities of liquor.

          • #7

            You need to change your avatar to “the reaper”. Bearer of bad news on our GM, but you’re right on most of the time regarding Howie

          • JofreyRice

            I just don’t see it with the guy. I’d be cool with him coming from a non-football background if the results were there. I don’t think you can look at the roster and claim it’s talented, though. Jeff Maehl, on a 53 man roster, playing meaningful snaps? Nah.

          • #7

            Yep exactly right. Gotta blame Chippah on that too. Sheesh

          • nicksaenz1

            Or Colton’s boy, the one, the only…Casey Matthews.

          • Andy124

            Hit rate looks ok the last couple years.

            Cox looks good.
            Curry’s a good player.
            Foles is more that I’d expect out of a 3rd round QB so far.
            Boykin is great value for the round he was drafted.
            LJ is fine for a rookie OT and has given no reason to think he won’t be a future stud.
            Ertz has shown some potential. Hasn’t produced a whole lot yet.
            Logan has been fine for a 3rd round DL.
            Wolff has contributed beyond the level I expect from a 5th round rookie.
            Kendricks has been JAG, but at least he’s not a total bust, and there’s still plenty of time for him to get better.

            I think there’s definitely still hope for Howie. Totally on board with concern/lack of confidence in him. But not total write-him-off and get me a real GM type conclusions.

          • #7

            I guess when you list it like that it looks a little better…

            The man has a tough job, that’s for sure

          • Token

            Raise your expectations people.

            The Howie disciples are showing Ertz and Kendricks as beacons of hope for Howie Roseman.

            Doesnt that tell you all you need to know?

            I want Kendricks to be the player I thought hed be. But it looks like that aint gonna happen. 2nd rounder down the tubes. You need much more out of second rounders. You arent gonna hit on all of them, but you gotta hit on more than you miss.

            Ertz in the 2nd looks pretty bad. They needed a lot of things. A TE that has made no impact isnt one of them. Would Clay Harbour have made any more or any less impact than Ertz to this point? Ertz may turn out as a good player, not dismissing him. But a TE, let alone one that doesnt impact the game, was a dumb pick there.

            There are players that make IMPACTS as 2nd and 3rd rounders. You gotta build the backbone of your team with those picks.

            Everyone knows I hated the pick of a tackle at #4. Overall just a low impact player at RT. You expect more from a top 5 tackle than you are getting from LJ so far. And hes even playing RT not LT. Bottom line, hes gotta be ready to step up and start at LT next year and be good there. Peters will be gone.

            Heres the facts. Going forward you have THREE actual players from the 2012 draft. Cox, Boykin and Curry. And im being pretty generous putting Curry in there.

            2013, way early. But who do you look at and just see a player? LJ should be a part of things here. Ertz is atleast a backup TE in the 2nd round. Logan hasnt really shown anything yet. Im trying to be generous here.

            Then you add in the FA disasters.

          • Andy124

            Ertz may turn out as a good player, not dismissing him.
            Yeah ya are.
            They drafted LJ to be the LT once Peters is gone, so uh, not sure where you’re going with that. Having a stud tackle is a huge deal.

          • cliff henny

            good luck, token has hot red hate for howie. lane johnson isnt anthony munoz and ertz isnt gonzalez by now, they’r busts

          • Andy124

            Can’t argue with that. Not sure why we’re still wasting roster spots on them.

          • #7

            lmao

          • Token

            Does LJ remind you of a stud tackle so far?

            The need for a stud tackle to be a great team is a myth. But we have been over that before.

            Overall they have much lower impact overall than people like to believe.

          • #7

            I think you’re off as far as your statement about LJ. You say that you expect more from a top 5 tackle…he’s not supposed to have growing pains? He’s supposed to be a shutdown LT from day one? Sure, they took a risk as far as him being super raw, but someone has to take Peter’s place and maybe sooner than later.

            i like Ertz. I see where you’re coming from as far as his draft position, but this guy can be a weapon and he’s A LOT more athletic than I ever thought.

          • Token

            LJ is playing RT though. Id expect a superior LT prospect to at least be consistently good at RT. Again, its early. But ill be pretty worried if hes not starting to look much better in pass pro come seasons end.

            Im not dismissing Ertz. He should start right now just because, well what exactly is Celek bringing to the table. But even at his best, I dont see Ertz as a game breaking TE. There were other more dire needs.

          • #7

            Eh…maybe so. We’ll see

          • anon

            Hed only played tackle for a year or so. He was QB, TE, other shit before. His name is getting mentioned less and less. Chill B, this magic takes time.

          • #7

            Yep. I was thinking if I heard his name called or not. I haven’t

          • pjcostello

            With a left-handed QB, RT is LT. The only reason LT is so important is because on MOST teams, that’s the guy guarding the right-handed QB’s blindside. Not here.

          • Token

            More conventional wisdom thats usually a crock.

            Answer this, does Lane Johnson face the other teams best pass rusher every week?

          • pjcostello

            I disagree with you about LJ… yes, he’s a right tackle, but when you’re starting a left-handed QB, the right tackle is the one guarding his blind side — more important than the left tackle. Kendricks was drafted to be an outside LB in a 4-3, not an inside LB in a 3-4, so I don’t think it’s fair to judge him yet. Ertz was a player of need at a position of need for this offense and this coach, and while he hasn’t gotten many balls thrown his way, I fail to see that as an indictment of him, or of the pick. People like you are FAR too quick to judge, to be seen as the know-all armchair General Manager. The more-intelligent among us knew this would be more than a 7-game project, and know that the 2014 Eagles will be a darned sight better than the 2013 version.

          • Token

            Yea, I expected them to be a good team…………………

            Just so im clear. I cant judge Kendricks last year in a position you say is where he should play. Now I cant judge him this year. When is it safe to say a player stinks?

            I see rookies every season from all different rounds become impact players in year one, let alone year two. They just arent ever playing for the Eagles. I dont expect every pick to be a gem pro bowler. Id just like a few of them to be.

            Wake up.

          • pjcostello

            I think you should STFU and stop judging everyone and everything just because you’re anonymous on the Internet. You’re the guy at the bar who can’t shut up, and gets taken outside and beaten about the head with thick sticks. Wake up yourself, get off the Internet, quit complaining about every damned thing, and get a life.

          • Token

            lol.

            Ill never understand you people who get like this simply because of a opinion, the truth in my eyes, about this team.

            We all like this same awful franchise. Some of us just want to see it improve and refuse to celebrate and accept mediocrity.

            Why some have such delusions of grandeur about this team I just dont get. So much so that it causes a reaction like this. Craziness.

          • JofreyRice

            Cox is good. Boykin’s a solid nickel. Curry looks like he could be an interior passrush specialist at worst.

            I think the rest of your list is more about optimism–which is fine, but I don’t think it can be used as proof of Howie’s competence. Are the guys above building blocks of a really good team? Eh…I dunno. Maybe Cox could be a guy that becomes one of the top at his position. The other guys are just…a little better than OK.

            I mean, you are judging this within the context of the Eagles roster–which is to say the guys that are “fine” are just not being unseated by players that are clearly better. So I think that goes into it.

            And I think you’re ignoring the free agency aspect of player acquisition. Fletcher’s the gem, and looks like a #2 corner, at best. The Phillips move was fine, to kick the tires, but that was the only plan, other than rolling Nate Allen back out there. I remember last season, we all said, “well, that’s the end of Allen and Coleman”. Sopoaga? Casey? Barwin? Where are any difference makers for a terrible squad?

            It is dangerous to make qualitative statements, but like I said, I just don’t see it with Howie.

          • Andy124

            Agree about Fletch. Sconces is fine as a stop-gap corner for a year or two. Same thing for Chung, who just isn’t healthy.

            *Soap is a warm body at best. Were there any better NTs in free agency to get instead? (non-rhetorical)
            *Barwin is an above average role player.
            *Casey can’t get on the field. Not going to get all of them right.
            To me, FA is about filling holes with role players. This past offseason was the best job of that I can remember seeing. The previous year’s free agency didn’t go so well.

            I get the criticism. I’m not sold on Howie. I agree the players I listed aren’t PROOF of Howie’s competence. The final grades aren’t in on this draft class, nor the previous. They might not look so good down the line. But there’s plenty of reason for hope with them, and correspondingly for Howie.

          • theycallmerob

            I’m about where you are, with regard to your last paragraph. Well said.

          • Ascher Levy

            You forgot Ryans, a very solid pick-up who is leading the defense to respectibility.

          • JofreyRice

            Yeah, they got one solid year out of him. That was good for a 5th rounder. He’s been up and down this year, missed a lot of tackles, does not move as well in coverage, and is essentially as good as gone, with 6.5 mil owed to him in ’14; unless he renegotiates.

          • anon

            you’re not talking about Meco are you? Hell be here next year — can’t sell your best player on D.

          • cliff henny

            he 6.875m against cap, no dead money. he isnt worth neat that. like peters is 10m against, no dead, another guy not getting anything close to that.

          • Dutch

            You don’t think Peters is worth $10 Million a year? If the Eagles put him on the block in 5 mins, Peters would have a job and someone willing to resign him at $12 Million a year.

            Dominate Tackles are as imperative as franchise QBs.

          • cliff henny

            because someone is always willing to overpay an aging vet with deteriorating skills, doesnt make it correct. 10-12m is elite LT money, peters isnt playing elite. he’s very good. it’s final yr of his deal, my guess is he’ll get renegotiated down to a more cap friendly/managable number, with some guarantee and more yrs.

          • Dutch

            What of Peters skills are deteriorating in your opinion, and how is it not maybe an after effect of his injury? Peters is coming back off a serious injury and continues to dominate.

            Can you name a comparable tackle that is as effective on the second and third level as Peters in the Conference?

            The only guy I’ve seen that comes close to dominating his opponent as Peters is King Dunlap playing with the Chargers. He seemed a disaster in Phila because of the zone blocking scheme, but he’s keeping Phillip Rivers up right and probably in contention for Player of the Year.

          • cliff henny

            he isnt same guy, at least not yet. injury age, it’s the usually story in nfl. i didnt say he sucked, said ‘very good’. get his cap number down to 6m-7m, with signing bonus and extention. same with d-jax, and cut a ton of dead weight off roster.

          • JofreyRice

            yeah man. He hasn’t been the best player on D this year. I’d probably go Cox, Boykin, Thornton, in ranking the best consistent defenders. He had a couple big plays on Sunday, but the body of work has really not been all that great.

          • Ascher Levy

            Ryans is the QB of an improving defense and leads the team in tackles by far. I disagree with your up and down comment.

          • pjcostello

            In guys like Sopoaga and Barwin, they needed players experienced at positions where they had none on the roster already, with the 3-4 change on defense.

          • JofreyRice

            Sopoaga was really a non-factor in SF, and is a non-factor here. I guess they needed a guy experienced in being a non-factor? And it seems like Barwin has a completely different role in Philly than he had in Houston, sort of negating the “experience” aspect.

          • pjcostello

            Add Bryce Brown to that list, as well.

          • Token

            Why?

          • BlindChow

            You think Maehl is a Howie move more than a Kelly move?

          • JofreyRice

            OK, fair enough, clearly Maehl’s position has to do with him being favored as an Oregon guy. Change the name to Najee Goode or Roc Carmichael. The bottom line is, on a lot of NFL rosters, these guys wouldn’t make it. They have an opportunity here because there is no one better. That’s what happens with bad teams.

            Like I said, I think the poor ST’s play, regardless of coach, is indicative of the kind of talent they have at the bottom of the roster–south of marginal.

          • #7

            You’re on a hot streak today

          • JofreyRice

            Thanks, been drinking coffee and stabbing my 8×11 picture of Howie.

          • #7

            LOL

          • theycallmerob

            …but I do think adding the right QB can change a franchise’s trajectory quicker than anything else.
            Very true. See: Luck, Andrew (amazing how after all the Peyton time, the Colts picked the perfect year to finish dead last).

            Also, I don’t disagree with your comments re: the talent on the roster whatsoever (not so definitive on the responsibility). Between FA signings and the draft, I see (at the very least) the ST/back end of th roster improve dramatically next year and every year with Kelly.

            I don’t think it’s worth it to pull a RG3-type trade this year with so many other talentless positions on the roster. But if they do pull the trigger on a QB in the 1st rd, I’d bet my house that it’s Chip and co. behind that decision.

    • #7

      They built up their o and d-lines and whiffed on QBs for a couple of years until one fell in their laps. Love the way SF built their teams. I can remember thinking a few years back that SF would be good if the got something out of Alex Smith or some other coach. The key is, they didn’t reach for a QB which is what I’m afraid we will do. We need so much more than a QB especially if there isn’t a sure thing.

      Minnesota and TB are two teams that I can think of who drafted 1st rounders in spots where we may be drafting this year unless we give up a ton to move up…which we can’t afford to do anyway. I’m with keeping Foles and Vick another year if we can’t get Mariota…and not high in the draft. I’m no expert, but I just don’t feel that there is a can’t miss QB in this draft

      • Token

        You wanna keep Vick, shocking.

        SF went through coaches because they didnt have a very good QB. Kelly wont last long if he doesnt hit on a QB this coming draft. Harbaugh ended up being able to get a lot out of Kaep.

        If you keep waiting for the Andrew Lucks of the world you will be waiting a long time. Mariota at least could step in and play day one for sure. He already knows the system. Even the Skins had to jump up for RG3. When you know want a QB you gotta go make sure you get him.

        A QB can turn your team around quickly. We dont need a TON more offensively. They just need the centerpiece.

        You try to waste time building this D first you just run out of time. Guys like Mathis get a year older. McCoy a year slower. Kelly era ends. If they are serious, they get their guy now. You dont have a QB now you have no chance.

        Unfortunately, they are gonna have to rely on even more FA’s to help build this D back up. Theres just too many spots to fill. They are gonna have to throw money at Byrd and hope for the best.

        • anon

          Nah as soon as Harbaugh got there he had alex smith as servicable — whole team turned around.

        • #7

          Harbaugh used Smith to his strengths Token, which made him better and the team better. They didn’t take a QB for years after Smith except for Kaep and there were rumors swirling about him just being a wildcat QB strictly and they built their lines up.

          And why not keep Vick? Because you don’t like him personally? The man is a leader who’s been thru it all and that what a young QB needs these days is a mentor. These rooks are coming in and playing right away when a lot of them needed a mentor.

          JaMarcus Russell is a prime example. Johnny Football will DEFINITELY need a mentor. No way that man should come in and start right away….for any team or he will be ruined and he’s appears to not be mature enough

        • JofreyRice

          Harbaugh ended up being able to manage Smith much better than anyone else had. The year they went to the NFCCG with him, he had the least amount of attempts of any starter. Coaches tell you what they think of a player by the way they use them. Harbaugh installed the power concepts from Stanford, along with some of the creative OLine formations and ran ran ran.

  • anon

    Anyone think curry gets traded after this year? we probably get a 2nd or third for him. thoughts?

    • nicksaenz1

      Not hard to imagine, that’s for sure. Probably a third, only because he hasn’t had enough volume of production to command higher IMO. Rather see them keep him for the 4-down sets though and get rid of Geathers.

    • #7

      The guy has potential. Our roster isn’t good enough to get rid of players with potential. We need all we can get. The man needs to keep playing. Not like we have anything to lose

      • cliff henny

        mark it down…10/22 at 1-35, 1st time we’ve agreed on anything

        • #7

          Ah man it’s been a few more times that that. I think..

          • cliff henny

            disagree, lol

          • #7

            We’re on a decent streak today. Might last until the next article that Tim puts out…

            Glad to not be arguing with anyone today, but Token is lurking…

  • Addicted2Mula

    Idk.about yall but im happy Vicc will start Sunday to finish what he started with Giants. NO MORE LOSING AT HOME!!! Please and thank you

    • BlindChow

      Okay, I have to ask: is “Vicc” an autocorrect thing?

      • Addicted2Mula

        Nope

        • BlindChow

          HAHAHA!

          • Addicted2Mula

            Vicc, fucc, succ, thats how i spell with c (k) words. Just me

  • KimbaFuzz

    Glad to hear that Vick will start. Conspiracy theorist in me wonders if he could have gone last week….. I got the impression had Foles played even decently, he would have been the starter the rest of the way. That’s what that joint presser told me…

    • anon

      sounded like a passing of the torch.

    • JofreyRice

      conspiracy theorist in me said the way Vick was so relaxed meant that the job was his to lose–that he had some kind of assurance from Kelly, anyway.

    • #7

      Maybe they are really team players?? Both him and Foles. That is my thought

  • Will

    Kansas City is 7-0 doing it with a Magnificent Defense and a so so QB. KC #1 Defense, KC #18 Offence. Eagles #2 Offense, Eagles #30 Defense. Eagles should ponder improving Defense from 30 in the NFL to a top five Defense.

    • cheapmeat

      that sounds easy

      • Will

        Oh yeah with our FO being brain dead when it comes to getting Defensive players.

  • cliff henny

    can anyone explain PFF ratings to me? how in the world did Ryans end up with -1.7. never looked at them before, but friend emailed foles -7.3 article

    • Tony

      https://www.profootballfocus.com/about/grading/

      The Demeco score was BS and highlights the problems with their grading system. The PFF score definitely has value, but score processing may need to be analyzed and updated by their staff. They have to notice anomalies like this…

      • cliff henny

        thanks. how do they grade without knowing the plays/assignments? makes no sense. reading here and lawlors dgr’s, both countless times say ‘not sure who was at fault till get more coaches on playcall’.

  • ACViking

    Tim McM wrote:
    “the team [Eagles] is looking at the Seattle and San Francisco models: build a
    sound team largely through the draft and continue to take shots at the
    quarterback position until a franchise guy is identified.”

    Well, the SF model requires having a losing record for 8 CONSECUTIVE SEASONS.

    Seattle? They were losers for 4 straight years before turning things around.

    Is this really Roseman’s model?

    • #7

      EXACTLY. This is what i was just trying to explain to Token. It took a lot of losing to get that good and that crap will not be tolerated in Philly.

      People on here talk about wanting to rebuild, but when Sunday rolls around they will be PISSED about the loss and will still want heads to roll during this “rebuilding process” I keep seeing that people want.

      • BlindChow

        I think the rage level fluctuates depending on how they lose.

        People were pretty even about the Chargers loss, since it followed the expectations: bad defense, great offense. They were pissed about KC because it looked like a regression back to 2012′s miserable team (turnovers and general incompetence). And of course Dallas because WTF FOLES!??

    • Explorer51

      It needs to be noted that both SF and Seattle’s franchise QBs weren’t first rounders though, enabling them to get great talent in other areas. For example, SFs first pick was Aldon Smith in 2011 before they grabbed Colin Kaepernick in the 2nd round (of course, this is where we stole Danny Watkins thirteen slots earlier).

  • #7

    Well…since Vick is starting this week, do I start him on my fantasy team or not? Other option is Romo.

    Its not what you think Dick Colton! It’s just fantasy football :)

    • anon

      haha I started Foles last week and dropped RGIII — ouch. I’m starting Vick in one league — it’s the Giants — we about to eat.

      • cliff henny

        eagles are due for a laugher at home.

        • Andy124

          We were due last week too. :/

          • cliff henny

            giants really stink though. freeman was about as good as foles last night, minne is in trouble. too bad, am hoping freeman comes on so 1 less team qb shopping

    • Richard Colton

      the shame isn’t in starting him, the shame is having him on your team in the first place. you know…you just…why the bleep…ahhh forget it

  • Johnny Domino

    “Hard to believe, Harry”

    Made my day.

  • Chali

    Great GIF, good for Andy but I’d rather not see him win the Superbowl. What he did to this franchise set us back bigtime and we need a major overhaul because of him. . . I don’t understand why you would want him to succeed after the last 2 years of a circus lead by Andy. The Eagles are all over the place right now and thank you Andy Reid? Ppppssshhhh. . . .

  • Ray

    Happy for Andy, he has been to hell and back in his life. I am glad he isn’t our coach anymore because we reached the end of the road but he was the best coach in Eagles history and will go into the HoF an Eagle.

  • Jernst

    The us against us, desean completely giving up on his QB and jogging pathetic routes was pretty obvious from the stadium. Just wait till u see the all-22 you’ll be pretty disappointed in desean. McCoy was fine tho