Eagles Draft: Sorting Through The Intel

Much has been written about the Eagles and their plans for the draft, which all of a sudden is right on our doorstep. We have heard hundreds of opinions. But at the end of the day, it is the opinions of the key decision-makers inside the NovaCare walls that matter.

Howie Roseman, Chip Kelly and Jeffrey Lurie are in no hurry to divulge their plans, of course. It does them no good. Misdirection gets them farther than truth-telling this time of year. But if we sift through what has been said over the weeks leading up to the draft, maybe we can see the overall picture a little more clearly.

Let’s look at a few key quotes from the powers-that-be and try to find a kernel or two:

Howie Roseman on the strength of the draft: 

“You talk about the offensive line, obviously. There are some really talented offensive linemen in this draft, defensive linemen. This is a really meat and potatoes draft, certainly early in the first couple of rounds with lineman, which is exciting. It may not be the flashiest thing, but it’s exciting. It’s hard to find big guys who can move, play with power, and there are a lot of guys in this draft.”

Quick thought: “Big guys who can move” early in this draft include Eric Fisher, Lane Johnson, Sharrif Floyd, Sheldon Richardson and Star Lotulelei. I don’t believe Roseman is trying to throw us off the scent here. The early portion of this draft is largely about the big men, most agree. It also needs to be noted that he thinks there are quality linemen throughout the draft as well.

Chip Kelly on the 2013 class:

“I think the draft has depth.  I don’t think ‑‑ there is not an Andrew Luck or RG3 or someone that you say that guy’s going to be a ten‑year all pro, one of the best.  I had the opportunity fortunately or unfortunately to coach against Andrew Luck in our league.  So he was as close as there was to a can’t miss guy.  I don’t see that type of guy in this draft at any position, to be honest with you.”

Quick thought: What pops into my mind is: If there is no “cant miss” quarterback in the head coach’s opinion, how could you possibly gamble on one with the fourth pick? You can’t.

Jeffrey Lurie, on the decision to attend Geno Smith’s private workout [the first such trip since he looked at Donovan McNabb back in 1999]:

“It’s a common thing when it’s an important decision. We haven’t had a high draft pick for 14 years, and I think it’s true with anybody that we’re going to look at that you want to have all the information you can. It’s a very important decision for us if we stay at No. 4 there.”

Quick thought: The visit tells me that they were entertaining the idea of drafting Smith. I don’t think ultimately they will. But if you were sold on the quarterbacks on your roster, would you be exploring the possibility to the degree they have? Likely not.

Interesting to me that Lurie threw in “if we stay at No. 4 there.” Maybe it’s nothing. Maybe it’s a tiny peek behind the curtain.

Howie Roseman on defensive players in the draft:

“The safeties in the draft is an encouraging group. You compare it to the last couple of years, and there might be more guys who go in the first three or four rounds this year than have gone in the last couple of years combined. So to find those guys that we’ve talked about in these settings, about how hard it is to find safeties, so obviously that’s an encouraging sign as we go through this draft process. The corners as well. It may not be a group where you see 4 or 5 drafted in the first round, but there will be a run on corners at some point in this draft. It’s a talented group. The same thing at the LB spot. Pass rushers are going to go quick like they always do. There may not be much of a run in the second or third round as you’d normally see with pass rushers. But I think there are high quality ones at the top and they’ll go quick.”

Quick thought: Some good information in here that perhaps gives us a better understanding of the Eagles’ board. One message is: if you want a pass rusher, you better get one early. Keep in mind that the Eagles intend to stay disciplined and will not reach for a certain position just because of scarcity. But maybe it’s a tie-breaker if two players with similar grades are sitting there at 4. The obvious name is Dion Jordan. If he is not the pick, then it’s possible the Eagles go into the 2013 campaign with largely the same pass-rushing group that is already in place.

Roseman seems to like the safety and cornerback class. Assuming everything falls right, I would expect the Eagles to target the secondary a healthy amount.

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  • Token

    Was watching a video on the Eagles site with Cosell and Caplan talking about tackles. Cosell shares my opinion thats its kind of become common thought that a LT is very crucial. But its just not the case. I really just dont see them taking one at #4. Not if CK is as smart and forward thinking as some say he is. Especially when you consider the kid would play out of position at RT.

    I also think corner is overrated as a position. Its just not a critical as it used to be when corners could be physical. Not to say you can have trash there, but you dont need high first rounds picks or studs there. I mean the Ravens just won without their star CB. I think safety has become more important than corner. If they trade back a bit I would be all for taking Vaccarro or whomever they think is the best prospect at that spot.

    So if they stay at 4 what should they take? Well I would think a DL or pass rusher. Id assume its between Star, Floyd, Richardson and probably Jordan. Trading down and acquiring more picks would be ideal and they may be able to do it if someone craves a tackle.

    • JofreyRice

      both you guys stole that idea from me.

    • Geagle

      The CB thing is a Parcells theory….Fanboys think the only way to build a good line is with 5 first round lineman…you dont need 5 studs, you need 5 capable guys that play as a cohesive Unit…look at the recent SB winners…McKinnie is like 50 years old, the Giamnts won 2 SB’s with that bumb playing LT, whats his name, coughlins son in law? Max Starks was the LT for the steelers, and he is pretty average….Yet we have 4 pro bowl lineman, 1 of which happens to be the best LT in the game, and is 100% Healthy…Like, I cant believe how many people think that I team with 4 probowl caliber Lineman, and a 1st round guard in his 3rd year…is going to draft a lineman with the 4th pick in the draft….lol We days and we find out!
      Its no coincidence that the Eagles spent a ton of visits on versatile lineman slated to go from rounds 2-5, most of which played atleast a year of Guard in college, and a year of Tackle. Loading up on a bunch of Todd Herreman types who can play multiple positions is the way to build this line up….not using the 4th pick in the draft on an OT that you might not even need for the need for the next 3 years….FYI, Id rather have Jake Mathews than Joekel or Fisher…..I dont see any chance of us drafting a OT at 4, but if we do, it had BETTER BE LANE!…..I dont care who we ultimately draft as long as he has a chance at becoming an ALL PRO

      • cliff henny

        they’ve brought in alot more 2-5 rounders than the 4 picks we have, that’s for sure. seems like kelly’s brought in more mid-level talent in his first year than reid did his whole time, or at least last 8-10 yrs

      • Richard Colton

        1)Kansas City – Luke Joeckal (OT)
        2)Jacksonville – Dion Jordan (OLB)
        3)NY Jets (via Raiders) – Geno Smith (QB)
        4)Eagles – Eric Fisher (OT)
        5)Detriot – Dee Milliner (CB)
        6)San Diego (via Browns) – Lane Johnson (OT)
        7)Arizona – Sharrif Floyd (DT/DE)
        8)Buffalo – Ryan Nassib (QB)
        9)Oakland Raiders – Ziggy Ansah (DE)
        10)Tennessee – Tavon Austin (WR)
        11)Cleveland Browns – Chance Warmack (G)
        12)Miami – Xavier Rhodes (CB)
        13)Jets – Barkevious Mingo (DE)
        14)Carolina Panthers – Sheldon Richardson (DE)
        15) New Orleans Saints – Star Lotulelei (DT)
        16)St. Louis Rams – Kenny Vaccaro (SS)
        17)Pittsburg Steelers – Corderelle Patterson (WR)
        18)Dallas Cowboys – Jonathan Cooper (G)
        19)NY Giants – Ty Eifert (TE)
        20)Chicago Bears – Arthur Brown (ILB)
        21)Bengals – DJ Fluker (OT)
        22)Rams – Keenan Allen (WR)
        23)Vikings – Manti T’eo (LB)
        24)Colts – DJ Hayden (CB)
        25)Vikings – Desmond Trufant (CB)
        26)Packers – Menelik Watson (OT)
        27)Texans – Robert Woods (WR)
        28)Denver Broncos – Tank Carradine (DE)
        29)Patriots – Jonathan Banks (CB)
        30)Atlanta – Jarvis Jones (OLB)
        31) 49ers – Jesse Williams (DT/NT)
        32) Ravens – Jonathan Cyprian (S)

        • Geagle

          Gotcha…but you owe me 10 names that will be drafted by the Eagles

          btw Jarvis to Atlanta is a sneaky good call…I think he fits well in a 4-3 and would be dirty paired with witherspoon…1st time I ever seen someone Mock Jarvis to atlanta and I like it

          • Richard Colton

            wait…what? that could be drafted in round one? or the entire draft?

          • Geagle

            entire draft…when the draft is over give me the 10 names that you feel are most likely to be birds….you can use different strategys like, just picking a player for every pick, or forget the hard to figure out 7th rounders, and list like 2 guys you think we would pick at 4, or 3 guys in round 2(to give yourself better odds at getting it right in the easier rounds)…however you want to do it…Just 10 names you think will be birds when the draft is over

          • Geagle

            and because trades make everything crazy,….Im just going to record the guys you had in each spot(doesnt matter the team)….so if the jets trade doesnt happen, and Oakland takes Geno, you would still get the point for #3

          • Richard Colton

            great. thanks for keeping score BTW. I love that my mock is getting random down votes. Is it because I don’t have Brad Wing in the top 32?

          • Geagle

            lol people are just miserable

          • JofreyRice

            ourlads.com has a pretty cool mock draft tool, if you’re into that kind of thing.

          • CJ

            Dion Jordan, Jesse Williams, Darius slay, Zak dysert, Barrett jones, Matt Elam, Robert woods, geathers, Alonso, star

          • Geagle

            confirmed

        • JofreyRice

          Jeez, can’t see Detroit passing on a LT. They lost Cherilous and Backus retired. I think they have to get someone to protect Stafford

          This is well thought out. My personal opinion is that Alec Ogletree is going to get drafted before Te’o, but the Vikings do prefer tackle-to-tackle runstuffers, so you might be right.

        • Jason N.

          I agree with Rice, hard to see the Lions passing on Lane Johnson, unless they’re confident then can pick up someone in the 2nd that will do fine.

          Otherwise Milliner is a good pick for them.

          • Richard Colton

            yeah. Interesting how LJ has gone from a 7-12 pick just a week or so ago to a potential top 4 pick.

          • Jason N.

            Hype is a powerful thing lol.

            Honestly. I’m still skeptical about Lane Johnson. He’s still pretty damn raw. He’s like the Dion Jordan of the offensive lineman in this draft.

            That’s why I like Fisher more. He got the best of both side, great atheticism and good skill sets already in place.

      • Jason N.

        The Giant player you’re talking about is Chris Snee. And he’s a guard you idiot. If you’re going on a rant, at least get your fact straight.

        You don’t need to draft a lineman within the 1st 5 spots to get a stud player. Sometimes you luck out and your 2nd-7th round offensive lineman become a diamond in the rough.

        It just happen to be that 2 of the very best prospects of this year draft where there is no elite talent happen to be Eric Fisher and Luke Joeckel. They might not be elite like Andrew Luck or Cam Newton type of player.

        But they are as close as you can get in this class.

        If you can get a quality lineman in the 4-7th rounds. Then no team will ever draft a lineman from the 1st three rounds.

        But back in reality here, the best prospects go earliest. Especially if they play a position of important like LT or QB or CB.

        You can draft a mid-late round lineman hoping he’ll work out but chances are you’ll have better luck getting a better prospect in the 1st three rounds and put your money on him turning out a pro-bowl career.

        What happen if you load up on 4-7th round player and they failed to play well together or even individually?

        Late round prospects are taken as a gamble for their upsides and need more time than the earliest rounds, who can start right away or at least compete for the job with a good chance of winning.

        I agree with Peters, Herremans and Mathis being pro-bowl material players. But not on Kelce, he still have a long way to go to beat out other centers.

        And guess what?
        3 out of 5 of our starting lineman are at least 30 right now.

        That include both of our tackle position and a guard.

        Most football players retired around the age of 35. There are few exceptions like kickers and punters and Brett Farve.

        But most of those who are retiring around that age have been playing the last 1 or 2 years downhill after they hit their peak a couple years earlier.

        So assuming Jason Petters and the guys start going downhill after next year or two years from now.

        This draft is the perfect time to draft someone like Eric Fisher to train to replace Jason Peters at age 33 who at that time have a pretty strong chance of going downhill and still ask for a lot of money.

        I’m not saying Jason Peters will be greedy like Revis. But most likely that’s when the money being paid to him no longer matches the production he give you.

        Eric Fisher matches what we need on the team and if he last till 4th will be one of the best players available if not the best.

        I don’t see why the Eagles shouldn’t draft him then.

        • Geagle

          sher and Joekel are going to be the 1st two picks in the draft…we pick 4th
          Yeah my bad, not snee…the other white guy, who I think either just got restructured, took a paycut, or atleast talked about it….
          Uhh, NO team would ever draft a lineman in round 1, if you can get better lineman earlier? uhhh…Fisher and Joekel are Darn good LT prospects and they will be good players(I think good but not great, come draft day If I hear one of there names, I wouldnt complain..I just dont think we will hear there names going into the draft…but It wouldnt bother me to see great Talent at any position on my team…No matter how many good, and capable OLine prospects there are in a draft class, there will always be good prospects at other positions, Teams wont just ignore all the other good positions because this is a great Line class and make the first 20 picks in the draft Lineman…You will find very good NFL Lineman after round 1 EVERY SINGLE YEAR..and not just 1 or 2 per class..Because there will be other great players at other positions, good Lineman will fall…A guy like Pugh might be on the board at 35, who is a first round talent…If teams believe he is an NFL Tackle in spight of his arms, he wont make it to round 2. If Kyle Long didnt have the baggage, he wouldnt make it out of round 1. I wouldnt trust him to pick him in round 1, unless chip kelly was our coach….He is a darn good player, who would even be worth trading into the end of round 1 to go and get(I dont think you need to because Pugh and Long will be available, atleast 1 of them will)..Then you got other Lineman Like Brennan Williams, who would be round 1 talents, but because of past injuries will fall to round 3, possibly beginning of round 4.. There are all kinds of good guards, which is a devalued position that you can always find in round 5…I prefer the studs in round 2, because they can also back up your RT in case of an emergency
          I will stand up and cheer if I hear that the Eagles drafted anyone but Geno or Millner…including LANE who is my favorite of the 3, Fisher and Joekel…but it doesnt mean I think its going to happen

      • FMWarner

        Coughlin’s “bum” son in law (Chris Snee) isn’t a tackle, he’s a guard, and he’s been to four Pro Bowls. Their LT has instead been David Diehl during their Super Bowl runs…yep, another Pro Bowler. So if you want an example of how you can mesh a bunch of mediocre guys into a cohesive line, try another example.

    • Geagle

      Trying to read between the lines, rarely works….but If I am reading between the lines, I read it as saying we are drafting Dion, Mingo, or Ziggy….
      He talked about how this is a deep position, at every position of need for us, with the exception of QB, and Pass rusher…He didnt strike me as in love with this QB class, but He did say that there are good pass rushers at the top, but they will come off the board quickly, and once you get to round 2, its slim pickings at that position….The Eagles have shown a ton of love to Justin Pugh, is it Legit, or is it the smokescreen for Long?..
      If you guys take a look at the prospects we used our visits on…the reoccuring theme is rounds 2-5, Olineman that have played both Guard AND Tackle in college…and since there is a chance that our starting line is already in place….makes a ton more sense to me, to add versatile depth…instead of using the 4th pick on one of our 2016 OT’s

      • Tom W

        Exactly. If we are reading into things, how can’t read you read into the line where Howie says there are alot of good lineman in the first COUPLE OF RDS in this draft …. that is the most important thing he has said all offseason along w only a few stud passrushers at the top. He didn’t say first couple of picks …. because he reads the damn scouting grades and he knows the analytics and historical positional analysis.

        Otackle is historically much riskier than most positions in the first round. LB is one of the safest.

        Otackles taken in first rd and second rd have same chance historically of becoming probowlers or all pros.

        This draft is deep at otackle (and guard-otackles). Not deep at all at edge rusher.

        Chip likes versatility.

        We are returning 4 quality ol starters (who also happen to be athletes) and a first rd og whose strength is run blocking.

        We only have one olb with experience in the 3/4. Olbs are basically your d-ends in comparison w the 4/3 defense. Hence they are our pass rushers. Hence olbs is damn important. Cole will be playing out of position for a longtime veteran.

        If we are theorizing that we should cut the best ltackle in football next yr (why I have no idea), wouldn’t it be more logical that we cut Cole after this year and need a replacement for him like JOrdan rather than a guy who may can play ltackle just to save money by cutting Peters????

        That sporting news article backs up what I have been saying and also supports what eaglesrewind.com has been saying ….otackles aren’t safe for godssake

        http://aol.sportingnews.com/nfl/story/2012-04-22/nfl-draft-2012-first-round-disappointments

        • Richard Colton

          Come on Tom, where’s the chart?

          the methodology for your study kills it for me. It’s way too scattershot. The sample size is 319 but it doesn’t account for draft positioning. There’s a big difference between “1st round” and “top 5.” I’m guessing you like Jordan (me too) so you’re pumping up the LB stat as being a safe pick. 3/4 OLB and 4/3 LBs are different breeds. Your AOL study doesn’t differentiate.

          And no one is talking about cutting Peters, but it’s certain that no matter what else happens with him next year, he’ll have a birthday. You want to cut Cole, but not Herremans? They’re the same age. OT is a need for this team. A first round tackle wouldn’t be an automatic mistake.

          • Jason N.

            According to Tom little article up there. The best position that will make multiple pro bowls will be safety. Then let draft Kenny Vaccaro at 4th overall.

            *sarcasm*

          • Richard Colton

            It also makes the point that a first round QB is always the wrong call. If I mail the chart to Indy, think they would trade us Luck for a 2nd rounder?

          • Jason N.

            Maybe if we’re lucky, they’ll give us Luck for a 3rd round pick and a “pretty please”

            I think why there are so many linebackers and safety making the pro-bowl more than offensive lineman or quarterback is because safety and linebackers are constantly changing.

            You might have a different linebackers or safety each year more so than let say a quarterback or offensive lineman.

            Unless you’re the Baltimore Ravens then you been rolling with Ed Reed for years or Troy Polamalu with the Steeelers.

            It’s like every 2-3 years the best safety or linebackers suffer some sort of freak injuries or decline, and the next best guy on some other team become the best and he go to multiple pro bowl cause he beat the other guy be default.

            I think that might inflate the number a bit. But with QB, a QB great QB tend to play at a high level for a really long time.

            Hence why guys like Brady or Rodgers always make the pro-bowl unless they’re in the Super Bowl.

            Offensive lineman are mostly the same as QB in my opinion too. Great linemen who make the pro bowl tend to go to another 1 or two consistently. They tend to stay the best over a period of time not drop off after a year or two.

            But that’s just my theory.

          • Geagle

            NOt a mistake…but when you consider our roster, and whats available in round 2, and what ISNT available in round 2…it would be a real shame. But adding a starter I can count on for 8 years at ANY position, is NOT a mistake.
            Peters and Herremans will still be our starting tackles in 2015…The bigger question in my mind is, will Watkins and Mathis be the guards…but guess my brothers in green, tuesday is almost over, and tomorrow is Xmas Eve!!! and we can all get an idea of what the hell the new look Birdies will be
            Every Expert is predicting a bad year for us with 8-8 being our best case scenario…we shall see, but because our Offense was so stale last year, and guys were so misused, and Injuries…I dont know how we can automatically say we will be bad…Before Andy called plays, that everyone knew exactly what we were running, and before everyone got hurt…we ALLEGEDLY had a good offense…Just by pounding the ball, high tempo offense, being in better shape then everyone, wearing everyone down, no one having any clue what play chip will call this year, I would NOT be surprised if the Eagles put up alot of points this year..and our secondary, by default will AUTOMATICALLY be about 5 times better than it was last year..Cox,Graham,Kendricks will be better, Demeco will be better, Connar Barwin and Cary Williams can be counted on, and in the limited snaps that Sopo plays, he will be an asset….so right now, we have about 7 defenders we can count on to be part of a good defense…Curry is the Enigma, and how much better Cedrick Thorton can become is also a question mark….If Bradlet Fletcher doesnt hurt his knees again, Philly will love him…Chung and Coleman are a problem..Swearinger or some Tone setter needs to be added at safety
            ………………..
            So while Im not going to sit here and proclaim that we will win 12 games and be back in the playoffs…Im not ready to say that we will automatically suck next year and only win 5-8 games….and the player Im probably the most SToked about, Arreliuos Benn. Im telling you right now, matter of fact, I PROMISE RIGHT NOW, that If Kenny Phillips, Bradley Fletcher and Arrelius Benn’s Knee’s all hold up, Howie and Chip will look BRILLIANT and those 3 will be the steals of free agency…Of course, we cant count on it, and its far from a given..but I dont think they would be here if it wasnt possible…we had some horrific bad luck with injuries…If ANYONE is owed some good injury Karma is the EAGLES

    • http://www.philthycanuck.com/ Adam

      To say that Chip would be not as smart and forward thinking as some say he is just because he may not share your opinion is a tad silly. There’s a reason why he’s at NovaCare and we’re on this website, or Cosell and Caplan are in a studio. It would be ridiculous to completely dismiss a potential career starter because of what position he plays, especially since all these DL/pass rushers have a lot more question marks than the tackles.

      The whole idea of taking this guy would be to make him Peters replacement. Even if you have him at RT next year, A very expensive and aged Peters then becomes very expendable in 2014.

      It might not be the pretty choice, but that doesn’t mean it’s not a good one.

      • http://twitter.com/Lez215 Dutch

        I agree. There are to many questions surrounding every Defensive entry in this draft, Tackles at the top of this draft have been rated the best and most talented participants in the draft. Teams looking to add depth and talent to their roster following the common sense strategy of taking the best player available will limit the probability of failure and add value by selecting one of the 3 Tackles if available.

  • http://www.facebook.com/todd.orange.1 Todd Orange

    Okay only because I am itching to do so an I am sure I will probably repost as the days go on but I am going to give my draft predicitons. I understand that I am totally putting myself out there for critisim but who the hell cares.

    Round 1 Pick 4: I really wish Dion Jordan is here but he won’t be so we trade the pick away

    to SD who is sitting at 11. We receive the 11th pick in the first round. 2nd rounder 45th overall pick; and 4th rounder 110th pick.

    Round 1 Pick 11: Star Lotulelei DT Utah (Not sure if he drops this far but there is a chance he will. If not look to Jarvis Jones or Mingo)

    Round 2 Pick 35: Jonathan Cyprien DB

    Round 2 Pick 45 (From SD): Kyle Long OL Oregon

    Round 3 Pick 67: David Amerson CB NC State

    We trade Nick Foles to Minnesota for a third round pick (Work with me)
    Round 3 Pick 83: Kiko Alonso MLB Kiko Alonso

    Round 4 Pick 101: Gavin Escobar TE SD State

    Round 4 Pick 110 (From SD): Joe Kruger DE Utah

    Round 5 Pick 136: Zac Dysert QB Miami of Ohio
    Take your pick in Round 7

    • CJ

      Atthis point you’d have to move into the back of the first to get Cyprien. He may not get past Baltimore, but he surely won’t get passed up by SF. Twice.

    • CJ

      Also, I’m a bit more optimistic about Jordan being there at 4, but I’d still trade down. There’s are scenarios out there where Jordan, Star, Richardson, Vaccaro, Fisher, Johnson, Cooper, Warmack, Mingo and Austin are all still there when we’re up (For example: Joekel, Smith, Floyd, or Ansah go top 3 in some order). If that’s the case, I’d gladly move down as many as 8-10 or so spots and take whoever’s left from there and my extra picks from a deal and see what happens. If we end up with any one of those 10 guys, I can’t be disappointed. If you can get a safety, DL and OL in the first two rounds of this draft, you’re in great shape. Really like Hayden too, but his stock’s been rising lately and I’m not sure if I like him as a top 20 pick.

      • Richard Colton

        Tough sell to the fans if you start draft night with the #4 pick and end the night with a guard or safety. Don’t you think the Howie/Chip era will want to start off with a bang? Like a premium position?

        • CJ

          I don’t care about premium positions. I care about premium PLAYERS. If there’s a fan of the eagles looking at this draft demanding an offensive skill player out of that #4 pick, he probably still has you’re “Dirty 30″ photo framed on the wall. Same goes for someone wanting a pure pass rusher on a 3-4 team with like 5 or 6 of those already and no room to put them on the field.

          The idea behind a G is the same as an OT: Get Watkins out of there, just keep Herramans at RT instead of moving him back to G. Either way you cut it the names are the same (Peters, Mathis, Kelce, Herramans and Draft Pick), what difference does it make? As for safety, if anyone who has watched this team’s safety play since Dawkins left, and watched us pass up Earl Thomas, and is angry at the thought of spending a high pick at the position, well, I’m not sure what to say.

          I don’t care what the position is, get guys who can help this team win this year and many more. One isn’t going to make a huge difference.

          • Richard Colton

            Hahaha. true – but perception is part of running a billion $ company. I’m not sure after the 2010/2011 debacles, Howie is willing to take that big a risk with the first pick of the CK draft.

            If you trade down and take a guard/safety as the first pick of the era, my thinking is that two things need to happen in order for the move to be viewed as successful to the fan base. 1st – the guard you take better be the next Steve Hutchinson. 2nd – the player the media & fanbase agree you passed on better not become an All Pro at a premium position. That’s banking on two things happening, which is why I’m thinking it’s too risky a move for year one.

          • CJ

            Eagle fans have proven they’ll pony up regardless of the team’s performance, so money in a rebuilding year won’t be an issue. Now if one rebuilding year turns into 5 rebuilding years, that’s another story. It’s far riskier to draft a QB in year one in a down draft than to play it safe. As to your point, this fan base was screaming for a safety instead of Graham not too long ago, and now that’s suddenly too risky? Sorry, I don’t buy that for a second.

            Risky is drafting Ricky Williams because the fans said so when you should be drafting Donovan McNabb. The fans shouldn’t be any part of the equation on draft day. Winning should be. “If you build it, they will come….”

          • Richard Colton

            good point with Graham. Two different years, two different drafts. Remember that year? We were (in our minds at least) a superbowl team. We had one perceived weakness – Safety. This is a rebuilding year. We have holes all over the place: OT/DE/OLB/DB/QB all “premium” positions.

            We start thursday night with the number four pick and end the night with Jonathan Cooper and an extra 2nd round pick, will you be happy?

          • CJ

            Without question. You said it, we have holes all over the place. Cooper could just as easily be the best OL in this draft in 5 years from now as Joekel, fisher, Johnson, or Warmack. He’s graded out as the best at his position for what the Eagles are expected to run.

            An extra 2 can make a huge difference for this team. More than the difference between Fisher and Cooper, IMO. It’s the same other 4 OL on the field, so who really cares what position they play? Peters maybe not being the best OL in the NFL 3 years from now isn’t a good enough reason. Herramans has proved he can play RT well, and having a All-Pro caliber guard next to him will only make him better.

            They could then have 2 of the top 10 picks on Friday, or move back into the 1st and get another guy that slips some, like a Carradine, Hayden, Cyprien, Jones, or someone else that really falls hard that we don’t expect.

          • Richard Colton

            This is where we disagree. I see the O-line as a potential disaster. Too many questions. Too much age/injury. Can we bank on Peters/Herremanns/Watkins/Mathis for the next three years? Lot of miles on those 30+ year old knees. Who’s in the cupboard other than 5th round Dennis Kelly? I’d feel a lot better about a SB run in 2014 or 2015 with a few other options.

          • CJ

            There has to be balance between what we need now and 3 years from now. Even in the late first, you can draft a plug and play OL in most years, so drafting one this year at #4 isn’t necessarily, well, necessary. Next year’s draft looks to be just about as good at this year’s at the top, maybe even better. And this year it’s deep, so drafting one in the 2nd or 3rd isn’t ignoring the issue by any stretch. I’m not saying OL isn’t a need, I’m saying it’s not a need that justifies the #4 pick this season.

          • Richard Colton

            I’m just trying not to think with my heart. I know as soon as the draft is over and training camp starts, I’ll be thinking playoffs. In my head, I know this is a two to three year fix.

            The other thing that I think is dangerous is trying to project next year’s crop of anything. I keep hearing about the QBs. We’ll see. Keep hearing about the OTs…we’ll see.

            As far as plug-and-play late 1st round linemen, there’s this guy Tom that I’d love for you to tangle with. He’s got some stats that show the difference in 2nd round pro-bowl linemen is the same as 1st round. The argument is meaningless for top five picks – but an interesting counter to yours.

          • CJ

            Pro Bowl is such a garbage stat anymore after they moved it before the super bowl. Ever since Leftwich and like 15 other QBs “made” the probowl that first year they moved it, it’s become irrelevant.as a stat attempting to define draft successes.

          • CJ

            not sure why that came up as a link. I have no idea what that’s to so I wouldn’t click it.

          • Richard Colton

            agree 100%. It’s a better stat than “starters” not as good as All Pro, but there are so few All-Pros. Not to mention, would you rather have an All Pro center or a top five DE/OLB? There’s a real measure of subjectivity here.

          • CJ

            And yeah, while the Graham draft was a different year/different draft, the effect is rolling. If we had Earl Thomas to pair with Kenny Phillips, no one would be saying safety is a need, and Thomas would’ve made the corners look a lot better than they did, and we’d probably still have a least one of the 2 starting CBs from last year, meaning that probably wouldn’t be a need either. Instead safety’s been a sieve ever since.

          • Richard Colton

            If we had a pick between 12 and 16, I’d love the idea of Vaccaro or Cooper or Warmack. If the Birds really think Warmack is the best player in the draft, I can live with it. Will Howie be willing to take the PR hit?

          • CJ

            If he takes an OG or OT, (either way!) there will be some semblance of a PR hit, because it’ll be admitting that Watkins was a mistake. Even that won’t be major because it’s admitting the obvious at this point.

            I don’t think there will be a major PR hit regardless. Sure, some dopes will try ot stir up controversy in the media because there has to be something to talk about, but with this being Howie’s first real draft being on the record w/o excuses, and Chip’s first in the NFL, I think most experts and fans alike understand that this is a unique front office and they may value things differently than most. That gets them almost a free pass (in my book at least, with maybe a couple exceptions) for this year until we can see how the pieces fit in the scheme and how everything plays out.

            Unless it’s Geno Smith, or a Whitner or Irvin type scenario where a guy gets taken WAY earlier than most expect, I think most fans will (or at the very least should) take a wait and see approach. Particularly in a scenario where they trade down and pick up extra pick(s) in Day 2. At least wait till Friday night to overreact :)

          • Geagle

            You guys know how I feel about Pugh and Long in round 2…but if we had to draft a Lineman in round 1, I would really hope its Jonathon Cooper. I think he will be a better NFL guard, than Joekel and Fisher as NFL Tackles(not saying they wont be good, but Cooper could be an all pro)….not to mention, if the Eagles draft ooper,. it would mean they also aquired atleast an extra #2, probably even a 3rd or 4th…Chance wll be just as good of a guard, but Cooper is a significantly better fit for us than Warmack. Chance has a problem, sweats too mcuh, dehydrates and wears down late in games..you cant ask him to run 90 plays a game(atleast there is a real chance that he cant)…He is also much more suited to play in a power blocking scheme like the Jets…Cooper can basically become the Guard version of Jason Peters. I have never seen an athlete like cooper at Guard, NEVER! The guard athletes that were comperable to cooper in the past were significantly undersized…Cooper is a complete guard and one of the best athletes that I have literally ever seen play guard….last time I checked, Guard was the real question mark on our starting lineup, Tackle is just a depth need

          • Richard Colton

            I really hope someone nabs him and warmack before the Cowboys do.

    • Geagle

      Trade back to the #5 spot(Lions), Draft Dion Jordan while aquiring a #132
      ……….
      Trade #35 and #239 to Bills for #41 #105, #177, Draft RG/RT Syracuse Justin Pugh
      …….
      #67 Draft TE Gavin Escobar
      …….
      #85 (by trading #132 from Detroit, and #105 from Buffalo, and 2014 7th round pick), and draft DJ swearinger
      …………..
      #101 Trade back to #117,Drafting C/G/T David Quessenberry, while aquiring #153 from bears.(I always see Barrett Jones mocked a spot or two ahead of us at 101, so I traded back, aquired a pick and settled on Qberry)
      …………..
      #136 CB Brandon McGee
      ………….
      Eagles aquire #150 from steelers, Draft NT Montari Hughes, for Jason Avant and 2014 6th rounder
      ………
      #153(From Bears) trade back to #165 Draft Gamecock WR Ace Sanders and aquire #199
      ………..
      #177(from Bills) Draft Quinton Dials, 5Tec from the Crimson Tide
      …………
      #199(From Ravens) traded to Seatle for #220 and #249
      …………
      #210 Joe Krugar 5tec Utah
      …………
      #212 Robbie Rouse RB Fresno State
      …………..
      #218 OLB John Lotulelie UNLV
      …………..
      #220 Jordan Rodgers Vanderbilt (anyone ever hear of his big brother Aaron?)
      #249 Safety Dexter McCoil Tulsa
      …………..
      Offense:
      RG/RT Justin Pugh
      C/G/T David Quessenberry
      TE Gavin Escobar
      WR Ace Sanders
      RB Robbie Rouse
      QB Jordan Rodgers
      …………….
      Defense
      NT Montari Hughes
      5Tec Quinton Dials
      5Tec Joe Krugar
      OLB Dion Jordan
      OLB John Lotulelie
      CB Brandon McGee
      S DJ Swearinger
      S Dexter McCoil
      …….
      What do you guys think?

      • Richard Colton

        wow. very specific. You like Quessenberry more than I do – but can’t complain considering where you got him. Not to mention you landed four potential stars in Jordan, Long, Escobar, Swearinger WHILE filling needs. If this our 2013 draft – count me excited.

        • Geagle

          lol…Dude, If this is our draft, I might spontaneously combust due to a Joy Overload

        • Geagle

          I think will have to compete with the Packers for the services of Qberry…and if he is good enough for Ted Thompson, he is good enough for me..they Zone block as well in GB

          • cliff henny

            always barrett jones

          • Geagle

            I prefer Barrett as well, but every mock I ever see has the Jags or Chiefs taking him 2 spots ahead of us in round 4, so in case its real I went with Qberry

          • cliff henny

            only howie would look at your mock draft and think “he didnt manover enough”

          • Geagle

            hahahahaha right!..Im really curious to see wtf Bellicek does, he only has like 5 picks or something petty

          • cliff henny

            he’ll keep dropping and aquiring till he has half the 6th and 7th rounds combined, cut half before camp, and go 13-3. hate him, freaking guy is a genius

          • Geagle

            sounds about right….He wont stay put at any of his spots

      • cliff henny

        that’s strong my man! even if switch pugh for long,my doubts he’ll last that long, seems like a very great and do-able draft.

        • Geagle

          Id take Pugh all day, and forget all about Long…Pugh even has the experience over long. Id go with Long, just because he has played a few games already at Chip’s insane pace…but I would gladly welcome Pugh

          • cliff henny

            ace sanders is a steal. that kid would be insane in slot. surprised you took him and didnt package maclin

          • Geagle

            I figure I would try to work the draft to aquire picks without trading away big guns that Im not sure if are on the market or not,,,and I figured, If I can figure out a somewhat plausible way of turning over the roster just by working the draft, howie style, than if a big move like Maclin or possiblyt Graham happens and it brings us valuable compensation it would just be a super bonus

          • http://www.facebook.com/todd.orange.1 Todd Orange

            I would take either in the second

        • Geagle

          To make it realistic and not completly swayed by my wants…I closely followed Walterfootballs 7th round mock, and actually tried to make it most realistic…like When I had a team trading up to our spot and giving us compensation, I made sure it was because there is a real;istic want at our spot…and when I chose to trade back and aquire extra picks, I also tried to stick to teams who had multiple picks in that round(more realistic chance they would part with one)….At 150 steelers were said to be taken Josh Boyd WR, so I said F it, and give them Avant(cheap, hard working charecter guy in the Steelers mold)

      • Tom W

        I like every pick … but I dont think Kruger lasts that long .. I think he is gone at least 30-60 picks earlier. Everything else spot on. I may take Long over Pugh but I like them both.

        • Geagle

          I thought that too about Kruger…I went by walterfootballs latest 7th rounder…and they Had Kruger falling to us in tyhe 7th, so I just stuck with it…but my guess is he gets picked before the 7th

          • http://www.facebook.com/todd.orange.1 Todd Orange

            I really like Kruger but I think we’ll have to grab him in the 5th if we want him. I look at him and see a less athletic, less strong but younger Margus Hunt who is a late first early second round guy.

    • Tom W

      All of that was amazing except not Jarvis Jones. 6th rd? How bout safety from Cal PA or another OL.

      • Geagle

        If I didnt take Swearinger in my mock, I would have taken both DexterMcCoil and Rontez Miles(love that kid)

  • Jason N.

    This is my mock draft.

    Any constructive criticism or comments are welcome.
    I listed my first choice and the alternative pick if that player happen to not be there.

    1st round: Eric Fisher (OT) or Lane Johnson (OT)

    2nd round: Sylvester Williams or John Hankins (DT/NT)

    3rd round: D.J Swearinger (S) or Bacarri Rambo (S)

    4th round: Chase Thomas (OLB) or Logan Ryan (CB)

    5th round: Leon McFadden (CB) or Williams Gholston (DT)

    6th round: N/A

    7th round: Earl Warford (OG)

    7th round: Marcus Davis (WR) Kevin Reddick (ILB) or Gerald Hodges (OLB)

    7th round: Michael Williams (TE)

    7th round: Dustin Hopkins (K)

    • Richard Colton

      Great value rounds 1-5. Maybe a tad optimistic? Fisher may be gone
      by 4. I doubt Williams makes it to 35. I’d love to see Logan Ryan in round 4 (mostly because I live in Voorhees and saw him play in high school) but he could be a late 2 or early 3.

      • Jason N.

        I really hope Fisher isn’t gone by 4th. But otherwise I’m okay with Johnson. The guy is a little raw but he play angry as hell. I guess if Miami have the possibility to trade to Oakland for Johnson, I have no problem taking Johnson at 4th.

        Though I think I’ll be okay with the Eagles taking Lotulelei and then Kyle Long in the 2nd. That should be my alternative option is Fisher is gone and they want Lotulelei instead of Lane Johnson.

        I know that my picks is a bit optimistic especially round 2-4. But hey that’s why I listed the alternatives :D

        Overall do you think you’ll be happy with that if our actual draft if a combination of any of those players?

        I think a more realistic one would be.

        Eric Fisher
        John Hankins
        Bacarri Rambo
        Chase Thomas
        Leon McFadden
        Earl Warford
        Marcus Davis
        Michael Williams
        Dustin Hopkins.

        Do you understand why I drafted a kicker?

        Because I think Alex Henry can use some competition, plus I have concern about Henry’s leg strength. The guy is accurate inside the 35. But not so much outside of that.

        I hate to depends on him if it was like a 45 field goal or longer.